FuRy -

[Xenon]

Jamz won't post his view he might tell you on IRC,

[Sacerockin']

Well I just saw Xenon being raped by Crema. I bet it would be different ingame. Wallhax gives you a lot of advantage, doesn't it Xeno? I'm just kiddin' :)

What Crema said makes sense. I don't have anything to add. It's just fucking COMMON SENSE but it seems no one here knows about it.

I don't know you Xenon but you seem to be a cool kid. Now, to be a "cool" person doesn't mean you are up to do whatever you fucking want without caring about others. What do I mean? You cheated and you didn't respect this game, players, nor community. You didn't give a fuck about it. You just cheated.

Now, you come here saying that you've found a cheater, which if it is true, it's awesome! but let me tell you what happens. You shouldn't be here. You should be playing minesweeper or spider solitaire but not AC.

Your "effort" of trying to catch a cheater isn't worthy mate. Do you know why? because if he does really cheat, he'll come back and yall will accept him as nothing bad happened. Or may be you won't 'cause you forgive all cheaters unless they're from Brazil. Am I right? You're the best example of it. Sorry if you don't like to be taken as example, but you earned it since you cheated.

I got a question for you guys. Why are you or why do you pretend to be worried about cheaters? they'll be back in a couple of weeks under the excuse of "everyone fails" "nobody is perfect" and "we all make mistakes once in life"

Yall just have to accept that, sadly, this game is going nowhere.

Peace.

[Roflcopter]

Seriously the character assinations on Xenon are just offtopic logical fallacies (tu quoque, ad hominem). They serve nothing to the topic which is centered on whether FuRy does cheat (or did for that game). Also the consequences of FuRy's cheating or lack of, or the lack of such consequences, are irrelevant to this.

[EndGame]

"...What Crema said makes sense. I don't have anything to add. It's just fucking COMMON SENSE but it seems no one here knows about it..." (Sace)

The other day I was trying to talk with a kid about life. He claimed that trolling and insulting people were ok. According to him, internet gives you the right to do it. Asked why, he answered "because it´s funny". He didn´t accept that the statements you make and actions you do in game show how you are in real life; in other words, they could be like a representation of your personality. that being said, if you cheat ...

*Now, some people feel free and with the right to insult and call each other cheater for free (without solid proofs and just because they were beaten). Furthemore, *these people are the one ruling the game currently (full of trollers, insulters, idiots, etc.). They do what they want, treating people badly, even going to ts and leaving offensive message (L.O.L). Instead of having fun playing, some people just have a hard time hearing or reading insults or stupid/childish things. Because of this, many people have lost the interest in playing or simply left our beloved game. Fair?

"...Yall just have to accept that, sadly, this game is going nowhere..." (Sace)

So what do we do? very easy, let´s stop it. NO MORE insults! no more cheating thing!. If someone is caught cheating or insulting, just kick him ("cough" forever "cough") if you want respect, then respect, and if you don´t just go home boy. This is enough! AC has one of the worst communities because we´ve let these people do what they´ve f/c%/$ wanted. I´m sure that in other games these people would be banned forever. Let´s do something! I can assure you we will have a more friendly community only with nice people who just want to have a great time playing and helping each other.


Faggots can go home.




P.S. There is no clear proof. Thus, FuRy is not hacking.
*P.S. 2 I´m looking at my watch to see how long YOU will take replying.
P.S. 3 The future of our game is more important than if FuRy or Xenon cheated.

[jamz]

My opinion, FWIW:
The incident at ~6mr left me wondering what the possible explanation could be. There's no sound give-away, no visual clue, no history of Xenon camping there. FuRy does not check that location by habit, and the stalking approach, as YWC said, trying to see around the corner, was suspicious, to say the least. I told Xenon that if he and Larry believed this was a cheat, it should be posted here for public scrutiny.
However, I didn't watch the rest of the demo in any great detail because my opinion matches that of ElCrema; whether FuRy or Xenon or anyone is cheating, it makes no difference to the players involved; they will continue to play each other. It makes no difference to the players who don't play CMs and inters; they will continue to have their pub games interrupted by "inter yadayada 6", removing what little skill there was in the server. And it makes no difference to me.

[Stranz]

A large majority of cheaters don't care of what their reputation will become once they get caught, probably they will try avoid the ban or keep doing the same few months later or in other games, the community is just a small portion of the game, and despite of being a focus for players that may want to get involved in clans and everything else, it just doesn't influence them to become better players, just look around you (blacklist thread is just the introduction to what I really mean).

Also lets be honest, most of the attention right now is going to the ACWC and what's around it, seeing the most representative event on this game atm allow "ex-cheaters" to play or take part on it, just looks weird, like doing a campaign against steroids on athletes, using Gregg Valentino as roster.

I am not saying that you simply cut the heads off, but just keeping them so close to do almost everything doesn't seem a good idea to me, "they learned", how can you assure that? also why just a few deserve a 2nd chance, just because they happen to fall inside the community by building some reputation?

People that have been caught and has "rehabilitated" from his past actions have to realize that they will have to carry the fact some don't think they deserve a second shot, even if they have done acts in good faith to show an improvement, doesn't mean everyone will simply trust on them again to the point to allow them go back in (servers/ community/ tournaments/ you choose).

I don't know why blacklisting works like this tho, obviously the existence of divided opinion on cheating breaks the community, although not being notorious it simply appears to be clear when topics like this appear.I could keep rambling but i know that would be a real chore to read and I won't repeat myself more than I already did.

PD: I joined late on community, was there know community members cheating on 0.93?, i am just wondering.

-
On topic, i didn't saw the demo and that wasn't the reason i posted, sorry.

...It makes no difference to the players who don't play CMs and inters; they will continue to have their pub games interrupted by "inter yadayada 6", removing what little skill there was in the server...

I hate that and everyone doing it, ironically the ones complaining of the lack of skill on pubs do this

[ElCrema]

Seriously the character assinations on Xenon are just offtopic logical fallacies (tu quoque, ad hominem). They serve nothing to the topic which is centered on whether FuRy does cheat (or did for that game). Also the consequences of FuRy's cheating or lack of, or the lack of such consequences, are irrelevant to this.

For a guy pretenting to be so smart it's amazing how you fail see that I'm not here assasinating Xenon's caracther, but yours. Sure, let's all get back to discuss Fury's demo, caus all the rest is meaningless and offtopic. You just carry on organinzing tournaments with your buddies.

[EndGame]

Again: If he cheats or not is no big deal. In a few months he'll be back from his ban playing like nothing ever happened. Hell, he might even host some server on next years' ACWC... Now, THAT would be ironic, wouldn't it? A cheater hosting servers and being responsible for logs in a major AC tournament?

Cheers to AC, a true safe haven for all fps cheaters!! \o/

What Crema said makes sense. I don't have anything to add. It's just fucking COMMON SENSE but it seems no one here knows about it.

I got a question for you guys. Why are you or why do you pretend to be worried about cheaters? they'll be back in a couple of weeks under the excuse of "everyone fails" "nobody is perfect" and "we all make mistakes once in life"

However, I didn't watch the rest of the demo in any great detail because my opinion matches that of ElCrema; whether FuRy or Xenon or anyone is cheating, it makes no difference to the players involved; they will continue to play each other... And it makes no difference to me.

I hate that and everyone doing it, ironically the ones complaining of the lack of skill on pubs do this

Yall just have to accept that, sadly, this game is going nowhere.

So what do we do?

P.S. There is no conclusive proof. Thus, FuRy is not hacking.

[Roflcopter]

For a guy pretenting to be so smart it's amazing how you fail see that I'm not here assasinating Xenon's caracther, but yours.

So you decide to character assasinate me too? Would you please simply put your points of view across instead of comment on people's characters? If I were to defend my intelligence here it would simply be offtopic.

Imo the part Xenon cries about is not the one that looks more like a wallhack [...] But anyways, if ppl that actually know about this sort of thing other than experience through use (like Xenon) come to the conclusion that [...]

Use of inflamatory/ derogatory word "cries" and an appeal to ignore Xenon's opinion.

If he cheats or not is no big deal. In a few months he'll be back from his ban playing like nothing ever happened. Hell, he might even host some server on next years' ACWC, this same tournament he may get caught cheating today and no one would care (some would, but that's just caus Fury is Brazilian and don't know how to talkz in funny egllish). Now, THAT would be ironic, wouldn't it? A cheater hosting servers and being responsible for logs in a major AC tournament?

The crux of the above being more a mocking of the fact Xenon hosts an ACWC server (although actually I admin it and Xenon never manages the logs).

I see now that you can't grasp what I'm trying to say. I'll give it one last go:

Made in response to Xenon, not merely claiming he doesn't understand your point but that he is incapable of it.

Congratulations to you and your buddies Xenon, you guys are turning AC into a great game.

Further sarcasm to imply Xenon is detrimental to AC.

The only reason I'm venting at this Xenon buddie of yours its because [...]

Here you actually admit "venting" at Xenon.

Sure, let's all get back to discuss Fury's demo, caus all the rest is meaningless and offtopic. You just carry on organinzing tournaments with your buddies.

I didn't say "all the rest" was offtopic. I said only that insulting Xenon was offtopic. I did go on to say that the consequences of FuRy cheating or not weren't relevant to the question "did he actually cheat?" but that's not to say that discussing said consequences is offtopic. I phrased it very carefully!

[Alien]

and who is Fury ? :) Why don't i see his post here ? if i would see my nick in blacklist thread, i would react. what do you think Furry about demo ? ;)

[ElCrema]

No need to quote that much Larry, I know very well what I wrote an I'm sure you know what I mean.

Now let me see if I get it: In the end to most in this community cheating is no big deal and has no consequences if the guy is cool (and friend of yours) and say he won't do it again. But you want us all to waste our time checking demos, why? Caus you lost and have bruised ego?

Ok, fine: Fury cheats!

Lets all go play a match, everyone is welcome (Sorry Fury, you can't come now, just next month!)

Xen00b Match A
connect o-n-e.tk 9999 match

But be aware Larry, I might lag a bit.

I know I'm persistenly going offtopic, so fell free to request a mod to warn/ban me, but notice this: I'm in the mod circle and I'm really sorry man, I swear I won't do it again!

[Z-karIuS]

@Alien, Fury doesn´t speak english, and I'll say again what he told me: "xenon is just butthurt 'cause I raped him in 1v1". read my above posts.

[Roflcopter]

No need to quote that much Larry, I know very well what I wrote an I'm sure you know what I mean.

Now let me see if I get it: In the end to most in this community cheating is no big deal and has no consequences if the guy is cool (and friend of yours) and say he won't do it again. But you want us all to waste our time checking demos, why? Caus you lost and have bruised ego?

I quoted you because you claimed not to have assasinated Xenon's good character. The cherry-picked comments show that's complete rubbish! :)

Xenon was banned from playing the aG Cup, although there's a legit argument not enough is done against cheaters it isn't something I will discuss now. Xenon posted the thread for those who would be interested, if that's not you then you may just ignore it. We won that game I think, and then the match 2-0 so we, good sir, were definitely not vmad.

[Xenon]

FuRy has never played me 1v1, he doesn't player ex-cheaters although he himself is one and plays with plenas and wagner. kkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk

[1Cap]

Good, the Xen00n may be a (ex xiter) as fast, I believe, for example, Waagner (Sonic) is no longer a xiter a long time!
When is the last proof that Waggner (Sonic) used xiter?
Realized in these five years that I play AC hexiste discrimination on the Brazilians.
Especially with those who play very well.
If they are not in clans non-Brazilian community quickly accused them of xiter.
Many are not in other clans because they do not speak the English language. Others because they have lower ages.

Now, tournament (ex xiters) involved. Denounces the xiter given by a ex xiter. This is a mess.

My opinion is that: respect is earned and not charged.

Well, it seems that this community survives only interventions without specific purpose.

The moderation of the forum is superficial. I read the same opinions, always repeat themselves each year. I remember perfectly the forum before this. The same things, same problems, all the same.
I really believe that all this is a hobby. Only an open source game. Not even the game designers can claim 100% of the time it was xiter case or not.
You want to ban someone just with words.
There are no arguments against facts.
Ex xiters exist ? Prove it.

Its about behaviors.

[tempest]

It took me until the end of the first paragraph to figure out what the hell "xiter" is supposed to mean. It's not like "cheater" was such an uncommon or complicated word, but heh.

Realized in these five years that I play AC hexiste discrimination on the Brazilians.
Especially with those who play very well.
If they are not in clans non-Brazilian community quickly accused them of xiter.
Many are not in other clans because they do not speak the English language. Others because they have lower ages.

This has nothing to do with either someone being Brazilian or (not) being in a clan.

The moderation of the forum is superficial. I read the same opinions, always repeat themselves each year.

So you suggest we should remove all posts expressing something that "has already been said by XY two years ago"?

I really believe that all this is a hobby. Only an open source game.

No shit.

[Z-karIuS]

FuRy has never played me 1v1, he doesn't player ex-cheaters although he himself is one and plays with plenas and wagner. kkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk

I know, and you didn´t cheat either.

[Edward]

@Sacerockin' : your whole post made me mad. If you do not like ac then go hating somewhere else.

To all people thinking that their is enough proof in this demo : you should blacklist me and many others players for wallhack too then.

This thread is obviously going nowhere.

[TayituUx]

So if i cheat,I can be forgiven, coz everyones makes mistakes =P right??? Ok put me on that joke that u guys named blacklist.

[paulmuaddibKA]

I wonder if Xenon hadnt accidentally posted his screen with cheat proof would he continue using cheats?
LOL

[1Cap]

It took me until the end of the first paragraph to figure out what the hell "xiter" is supposed to mean. It's not like "cheater" was such an uncommon or complicated word, but heh.

Realized in these five years that I play AC hexiste discrimination on the Brazilians.
Especially with those who play very well.
If they are not in clans non-Brazilian community quickly accused them of xiter.
Many are not in other clans because they do not speak the English language. Others because they have lower ages.

This has nothing to do with either someone being Brazilian or (not) being in a clan.

The moderation of the forum is superficial. I read the same opinions, always repeat themselves each year.

So you suggest we should remove all posts expressing something that "has already been said by XY two years ago"?

I really believe that all this is a hobby. Only an open source game.

No shit.

I think the irony is the most common weapons.
and I think the irony is a subterfuge for a weak mind .. imo. Course. But .. who cares?

Thx 4 share and express yourself.
1Cap

[Xenon]

I wonder if Xenon hadnt accidentally posted his screen with cheat proof would he continue using cheats?
LOL

My IQ just went down.

First of all, posting the screenshot wasn't an accident. I had already stopped by the time the screenshot had been leaked. I had stopped cheating 3 days before being blacklisted.

[fundog]

Rehabilitation :

Is the chance for a player which cheated as example, to work up to the old position he was, befor he got a ban.

The rules are given by people which does not cheat, because cheating is not welcome.

They are in the mercy of this rules how they get treated.

What is the rule ? (And here we have much of individuality and conflicts in AC. look above ...)

Additionally we haven't any "trial period", where this rules get forced and succesfully completed, where we can say at the end, yes this player did "understand". Even worse, people in a rehabilitation period (or call it after ban period), started to make their own rules and are overhelming the whole community with that.

It's very clear, cheating has definitly something to do with personality. Insulting, offending, trolling, not respecting other people are indicators that they don't understand what the ban was about.

We are far away to get this people to be a good and outstanding example. Because nothing is leading them to the appreciated result, they come back and are allowed to act worse. So learning effect is zero. They learned how to overplay their situation and also outplaying it.

They act unthankfully. They disappoint with their competences they earned from people which like to be around this people.

Everyone is free to choose how he act, but not free from the consequences.

What are the consequences ? (And again, here we have much of individuality and conflicts in AC. look above ...)

Everyone is judging them personally, by the own view. They never had a chance to work up officially their rehabilitation and to pass it. That is causing fights, when they show up with their personal skills and experience, because they are forced to be in defense. So the only thing you will get as answer, is the taste of the new setup which is out of control and also out of any normality lately.

Call it human. That's fine, we ARE human. And because we haven't anything else, i expect from everyone :

That they act like i am in front of them. It doesn't matter if there is a computer between. Behind every Computer is sitting a person like you and me.

There are people which have to deal with a hard life, and they want forget for once all the crap and have fun. And the last thing they want meet online, are unhibitioned insulters.

Keep in mind, someone could suicide because it's once too much.

Take care to each other !

"this post is a basic expression and not aimed to single persons*

[Oracle]

The intention is noble, fundog, and I admire that, but I feel it is too...idealistic :).
As for the rest of you posters...
Yes, all this discussion is cool, but we've gotten pretty offtopic in a rather straightforward thread. Maybe there should be a split in this thread?
Xenon simply posted what he thought was potentially a cheat. Jamz, regardless of his personal feelings about the fate of these cheaters, told Xenon to post this thread so that the rest of us could weigh in on whether or not we thought he cheated - not to go analyzing the fate of cheaters and the community's downfalls.
To be honest, if we have to make it even more simple, somebody (either Xenon or a mod) might as well just make a fucking poll - "Is he cheating?" with the options "Yes" or "No." If by some chance somebody actually does make a poll, I'd hope that you guys could vote without your predilection/prejudice towards Xenon, FuRy, Brazil, or whatever the fuck else there might be, blinding your judgement.
Thanks.

[kaz]

The fact is, TheAnthraX once were called cheater when he threw a nade randomly and killed someone on a clanmatch but nothing has been proven and i think this time you 're doing the same thing with FuRy.

ps: before i watch the demos i was trolling him on M|A channel.

about the ex-cheaters thing, the time that they can come back depends on who the cheat against and whose their friends, you see, some people i wont mention the name, not necessary, got back to the community after one month or two, because he was funny and everybody thought he deserved a chance, while Davitomon and Reedie went away of this comunity for more than 2 years, some people still call Davitomon a cheater, why ? because he pissed the wrong people, Reedie didnt know the community very well nor was as known as he is now.




" We know. We dont think you'll cheat. But we say it's unfair to leave you play because you were a proven cheater 8 months ago. I think the delay would be 1 year. Else, you can cheat every year (around september) and still play acwc.
As I said I waited more than 2 years. Why would it be different for you?

by Reedie » Mon Jun 18, 2012 10:33 am "

quoting Reedie from ACWC Forum : http://aftershock-gaming.com/acwc/viewto...p?p=42#p42

[EndGame]

Yes, all this discussion is cool, but we've gotten pretty offtopic in a rather straightforward thread.

The fact that the discussion went offtopic shows what people really care of. We aren't looking at one single person's behaviour in game but at the whole picture. As you could read, people are not so happy with the way some situations are being carried out.

The intention is noble, fundog, and I admire that, but I feel it is too...idealistic :).
As for the rest of you posters...

Any suggestions to improve?

I took fundog's words: "take care of each other"

[Undead]

When is the last proof that Waggner (Sonic) used xiter?

today
http://www.mediafire.com/?yugcezthoukmhtt

it seems that every case of cheating is different. comparing xenon to someone like wagner is a bit extreme. afaik, xenon only used cheats in 1 case in a spout of immaturity, whereas wagner has cheated on a consistent basis for something like 4 years. there is something with wagner's personality that causes him to continually cheat and not give a shit. xenon is most likely not to cheat ever again, probably about at the same chance of someone like mystered or reedie cheating again, whereas wagner and his friends are almost certainly going to cheat again.
if you want to punish cheaters, just don't let them play competitions, and don't play them in matches unless you really have to. you never have to let cheaters play competitions.

[1Cap]

When is the last proof that Waggner (Sonic) used xiter?

today
http://www.mediafire.com/?yugcezthoukmhtt

it seems that every case of cheating is different. comparing xenon to someone like wagner is a bit extreme. afaik, xenon only used cheats in 1 case in a spout of immaturity, whereas wagner has cheated on a consistent basis for something like 4 years. there is something with wagner's personality that causes him to continually cheat and not give a shit. xenon is most likely not to cheat ever again, probably about at the same chance of someone like mystered or reedie cheating again, whereas wagner and his friends are almost certainly going to cheat again.
if you want to punish cheaters, just don't let them play competitions, and don't play them in matches unless you really have to. you never have to let cheaters play competitions.

this is proof that this player uses xiter for 4 years?

I played against him also in ESL and lost by 3 points.

Complex surv

I do not think he a great player. in the map (desert) is very difficult to beat him.
Douze is also hard to beat him.

but in other maps is easier to win.(not 4 me )
Complex or try gohtic ...

he is fast and has great aim. but not so creative. he does not usually hide. it is easy for an adversary tactical, win.

you almost won. when you started talking during the game, you destabilized it.

however, at what time he used the cheater in this demo? that was kind of cheater? how are you sure? sure?

if you are sure then he will be BL tomorrow ,not?

I hope the jamz see this video. do you think is missing proof against this player?

I hope everything is resolved.

[Alien]

while Davitomon and Reedie went away of this comunity for more than 2 years, some people still call Davitomon a cheater, why ? because he pissed the wrong people

naah, it is about strength of that player, Davi was the main leader in the game, people followed him, he organized ESL, lead clan and etc, and if such player uses modified client, it spread very bad signal to all corners of AC, to all that stupid children around, it is wrong picture of game, it was idiotic from him, we all know he is good person, it is such system...

therefore firstly i asked who is furry (clan leader?, ACWC organizator?), obviously everybody give a shit if he really cheats ...

[pweaks]

Wow Crema you act like a 8 year old. As Undead said, every cheating case should be taken as an unique case. There's a big difference cheating a one game and cheating consistently. Many of these so called "friends" of ours have taken the responsibility and left the AC community and game for awhile. Some of them have even admitted that they're cheating. I don't know if you get some kind of satisfaction with your pal Sace by writing these completly meaningless posts which have nothing to do with the topic.