Map requirements for 1.1?

[JGAN]

Hello AC commnunity,
I'm a little new to the map making biz :) well i want to make a map that will work in 1.1 . So far, the biggest size I can have that will work is 6, but i would like it to be bigger, like an 8. What are the map density requirements? Also, when I built on the size 6 map and lowered the floor, it became unplayable in all the modes beside coopedit.

Basically, what is the maximum length, width, height, and cube distances between pickups?


thanks,
{FsC}fragBike

[Hearty]

Someone answer this!

[JGAN]

^like

[Brahma]

Read this:
http://akimbo.in/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7...2219#p2219

And check/compare the official maps...
TwinTowers, HeadShot City, Skycraper... and so on, will not exist anymore in AC

[JGAN]

why no more of the best maps??? ahh that sucks oh well


i dont really see what that has to do with my question brahma. can you just tell me the requirements? thanks

[Brahma]

The requirements are:

- You cannot have a big open area in your map more than 10000 cubes
- You cannot have a high ceil mean value (not greater than 30 cubes over all map)
- You cannot have pick ups too close each other (the exceptions are health pack and pistol clips, which can stay 3 cubes)
- The same for the flags... at least 30 cubes

Note, as we find more crap maps in 1.1, we create more restrictions to block these maps... so, read Mr.Floppy manual for more info...

[JGAN]

ok thanks a bunch. what defines "big open area?"

i will read the manual once again.

[#M|A#Wolf]

ok thanks a bunch. what defines "big open area?"

i will read the manual once again.

Like Headshot City, it's a HUGE big ass map

[JGAN]

like how many square cubes? and i liked headshot city... :P

[Ronald_Reagan]

Hm, is Robins_Oasis_1.1 a "hated" (or "bad") map? Just wondering.

[JMM]

Note, as we find more crap maps in 1.1, we create more restrictions to block these maps

NO PLEASE DON'T!

As much as I was happy with the new AC, these artificial limits (to an already limited engine I should add), IMO, really impede creativity in map making... more restrictions is just going to make it worse.

I have a few incomplete maps (in early stages and/or mockups of ideas I have had) that are now unplayable with these new restrictions in place and will require some major reworking if I were to ever release them. IMO, there should be other methods of getting rid of the garbage maps.

We really need other ways to get rid of the "shit" maps. And as weird as it might sound, I think that occasional TwinTowers/skyscraper_city/ EzJemArtilleryTunnelsWithFortsAndWalljumping gives nice variety to the gameplay.

[#M|A#Wolf]

TwinTowers/skyscraper_city/ EzJemArtilleryTunnelsWithFortsAndWalljumping gives nice variety to the gameplay.

What are you talking about? There is NO gameplay in those maps whatsoever. Just a bunch of noobs running around. TBH, I do like the occasional weird name map where everything is weird looking and the secret passage, etc, but I don't do it for gameplay... I do it just to play something different.

Also, these restrictions won't limit creativity. You see all the official maps? All of those fit into the restrictions but yet, every single one of them is creative and original in its own way.

[JMM]

What are you talking about?

The gameplay.

There is NO gameplay in those maps whatsoever.

Yes there is.

Also, I should mention that I was using them as an example, to illustrate a point. To be honest, those are the maps I care for the least (though I've seen some "good" oldvillage-esque maps). What I'm saying is that there are "stupid" maps that, even though they are nowhere near good enough to be officials/map pack material, show some (very..."different") creative talent and are actually fun to play.

Which, anyway, is beside the point.

Also, these restrictions won't limit creativity. You see all the official maps? All of those fit into the restrictions but yet, every single one of them is creative and original in its own way.

Yes, they will. And that's a bad example, fallacious at best.

Yes, obviously some creative talent has gone into official maps.
Yes, the official maps do fit into these limits.

That does NOT mean that the limits don't impede creativity, and that all good, creative maps will be fine with these restrictions.

[yata]

ok thanks a bunch. what defines "big open area?"

learn to read the post above yours.

you cannot have a big open area in your map more than 10000 cubes

read guides for mapping, mr.floppy's is very good..also the doc's are really helpful to. besides from that its really ask, watch, attempt and learn

JMM is sort of right, i know you want the image of ac to be a positive one but people have spent time and effort into these maps, they are some what helpful only for sniper training really but...theres only that select few that will miss them, to the future!?

disclaimer: i never said i liked those lag festival maps, thats just imo

[JMM]

What I'm really worried about is that some genuinely good maps have to be scrapped/re-done or will disappear altogether because of these limits, not the disappearance of the lagfest maps. I do think these maps, played occasionally, are fun; however, like I said, those are beside the point.

[#M|A#Wolf]

If you want to play those maps then make a little "shit map" party with your pals then make a server on 1.0.4 and play.

[JMM]

If you want to play those maps then make a little "shit map" party with your pals then make a server on 1.0.4 and play.

Either you've missed my point by a longshot or you're posting in the wrong thread...

But no, I don't "want to" play on a little "shit map".

[Alien]

don't comment current state of AC mapping, you only create enemies here, let develop the consequences of the current steps, they must realize it themselves :)

[JGAN]

Alright lol well this is a pretty interesting thread now... |BC|Wolf you must be one of those dev n00bs.

Yata, defining big open area means is that an area that has absolutely no pickups or entities or change in cube height or what?

are gema maps banned?

[Friedslick6]

Well supposedly so, if the flags must be 30 cubes apart. Honestly, I believe that 'crap' maps should be allowed. I can see why you wouldn't allow glitch-exploiting maps, but choosing only maps that fit a selected group's criteria seems rather... rude, no? If a map was distasteful or of poor quality, wouldn't the most simple fix be to move to another server? For me, I just play what I'm on, it doesn't matter to me. So I think that any map should be allowed, for free will's sake and all that.

[SpiRiT]

This thread has actually helped me. :)
Thanks!

But I find it bad that all custom maps are now dead.
Training Maps was fun when breaks were needed. It's a shame to see them go so soon ...

By the way, if anyone remembers ac_sand (professional map by me) and has it in their system, please come to a server and send it to me because my computer was whiped from a virus a few months ago. :)

Much regards,
SpiRiT. :)

[Brahma]

@ Friedslick6

Look... We created these server checks to avoid block servers by hand. So, in theory, all maps are allowed. The point is, some of these maps your own server will not allow you vote, and if you evade this, the clients will check it as well and they will not spawn.

So, if you create a weird map that is not blocked by the server checks, enjoy it.
But if it is too weird, make sure we will update the system to block this new weird map.

@ SpiRiT

The custom maps are not dead... but the mappers will need to take more care about small details:
* They cannot create too big open areas;
* They cannot make the overall ceil height too high
* They cannot put the items too close (same for flags)

If you follow these basic requisites, your custom map will be ok.
In the future we can create better map checks to avoid other weird things... so, do not abuse of the weirdness when you create a custom map.

[Friedslick6]

I'm sure there's a good amount of people who would wish to find no restrictions when creating a map for online play, regardless of the quality of that map...
But, I do agree with the big open area rule somewhat (what defines an 'open' area?)
There should be a public poll concerning the generally accepted rules of map making in AC.

[Brahma]

Any area greater than 10000 cubes is considered "big open area".
ac_douze is about 8000

[Alien]

Brahma, you can have less than 8000 and be laggy and vice versa. Checking should be in information level during creating map, for example the current warning with the count of tree models. I think you should check WQD parameter during mapping instead of position of pickups and layout. For me it is political restrictions because it doesn't help mappers to create something for this game. It is tool of your imagination how should something look and not tool to improve something.

What if you coop and you wanna test finished part of map ? (then you have opened great part of map)
What if position of pickups is limited by layout, multi - level map or wall with 2 accessible sides ?
etc.

[Brahma]

Alien... i never said this system is perfect, or we cannot code a better one...

If you are in coop and want to test the map, test it in coop or fill the big open areas with some solid blocks...

I did this yesterday.

[Friedslick6]

Okay, two questions; If the system isn't perfect, then why bother upsetting alot of people? And what is considered as 'perfect'?

[V-Man]

because more people were upset when nothing was being done about crap maps.

[Apollo{TyD}]

For me it is political restrictions ...

Nothing new. It is always something political for you.

What if you coop and you wanna test finished part of map ?

useless idea, cause it is not reasonably practicable.

ac_douze is about 8000

Douze is in my opinion a bad example for an AC map tho. It is original made for cube and therefore it doesn't follow the idea of making a "more realistic gameplay" in the first play. Retexturing, changing spawns and adding flag bases (a complete joke for all ctf map makers imo) doesn't changed the basic arena layout. The only good thing on Douze is - from a mapper's point of view -, that with making this map official the limits for WQD has been extended.

[Sticky]

so no more gema maps? i'm sorry but gema's are fun when u get tierd of killing and wanna test your movement skills.....so maps like iceworld can't be played either? i know your just gonna tell me "go play 1.04 then" but that's just wrong....i know it's a free game and all...but let's say YOU have your OWN server and want to play a custom map u made u can't? why? makes no sense.....