More maprestriction in next AC?

[shad-99]

Hey guy's/Girls xDDD

I heard of Z3ro that you increased maprestriction in next version of AC? -Is that right?
Well.. if so i will put down 40+ clan for good and start playing urbanTerror instead and open server there. .-Sad that this have come this far with that "Shit" :(

-Well you know me? from previous versions of 40+ that we started our 40+ masterserver and failed xDDD (well not entirerly)

Well this time i've had it with you devs -Sorry that i have to sayi that :( .. but you've really ruined this game!

-Any how.. It has been fun playing with so many of you guy's and girl.. and im gonna miss you all !

Well i lack details of my maps .. and i got plenty of critisism for it.. but hey!. i made it for having fun not to show of :D

So after this version 40+ will go down for good... -God luck with this game in the future xD

[Mael]

You're closing your clan because you heard a rumor.

[shad-99]

You're closing your clan because you heard a rumor.

Hey Mael :)

Well not really right away.. but i just want to know what this roumour is all about?
Z3ro a friend mapper have beta version of new AC. and he told me that some more restrictions are comming :( .. and that something about 17 cubes of heigt overall? .. -don't get that?

I will wait and see what's happening.. if more is comming about maprestrictions which is allready enought as it is.. we will end this for good!

[kleinkariert]

don't forget the bet..

[Alien]

FUCK OFF MAP RESTRICTIONS....

ps. i try "positive motivation" -> I will delete all my maps in AC if you will remove that restrictions ;)

[Nightmare]

As far as I know they are staying the same, but they are fixing the stuff that allows megatowers, etc. to be made.(since it clearly exceeds the ceiling limit and yet doesn't magically.)

P.S. Yay map restrictions. <3

[Hellspell]

what's wrong with megatowers? what's wrong with anything creative? why should everyone stick to a boring formula? Not that this will magically change the developers minds about mr's, this is just my question to you.

[al3rt]

I wish they would just put 1.0.4 back and leave it there...

[Bloodsport]

From my understanding, the height limit has become very very restricting in the svn version (or at least how it was a couple of months ago). Quite a few of the maps I made are now caught by it and I would hardly call my maps excessively open. Given that, I too will probably leave AC when the new version is released.

[Mai Mee Tur]

Lol. I feel that the new map restriction fixes are reasonable enough

[SleepKiller]

Map restrictions ftw. Nuff said.

[paulmuaddibKA]

If when the details are given, they make Shad-99 to renounce, then somethings is clearly wrong.
If someone has criticized Shad-99 for his lack of details, then something is clearly wrong.
If the developers and AC crew dismiss popular demanded things, then something is clearly wrong.
If something is clearly wrong, then something is clearly wrong.
P.S: I dont know jack shit about technical reasons around map restrictions. Please feel free to fill me in.
P.S.2:If its about high ping because high ceilings, I could understand map restrictions. But there are maps where high ping doesnt mean nothing as the purpose is not fragging. And as much as there is people who hate those, there is people who loves them. Just vote a labyrinth map in any given time when there are no others around and soon at least 3 or 4 players will join the server. Do a PF and see who joins.
P.S.3: Shad-99, please bro, never leave! You bring so much joy and fun (:3) and your server is always full of nice people!

[tempest]

If its about high ping because high ceilings, I could understand map restrictions.

Lol no :) Truth is, the engine was never built with such high maps in mind. You have to remember that Cube 1 maps aren't truly 3D. Consequently, all rendering and lighting are horizontally oriented. As a result, you get all sorts of ugly glitches on those high maps.
TBH, I personally don't care about map restrictions, so don't ask me for anything but the technical motivation ;)

[Mael]

You have to remember that Cube 1 maps aren't truly 3D.

Someone explain this notion to me. Is this referring to the way lighting is done, that each cube's(And entity's) position on the X&Y axes is locked, both, or something else?

The only thing I can think of is there are two values(Or dimensions) that determine the height of each vertex in a map; cube height and vdelta. That and lighting is calculated without regard for position along the Z axis(It could be said walls "inherit" their light from the cubes next to them; the light from adjacent cubes is "stretched" over).

I hear this comment all the time and something about it rubs me the wrong way.

[Ronald_Reagan]

From what I see of your maps, you wont have any problem. As was stated, it makes sure previous requirements that could get avoided are unavoidable. This is reinforcing the average ceiling. If your map has too many spots (I think 6000?) that are over so many cubes (I think 20?) your map will not pass. If you want, I could get these exact numbers for you, but afaik your maps wont have a problem.

[[SODA]___ME___]

Ronald_Reagan, thanks for that info. Now I have question, I understand the need for a better map check, but do you know why the limit is reduced from the 30 cube limit to 20?

[Ronald_Reagan]

I'm not sure of my numbers, hence the ? at the end of each place where I gave numbers.

[Bloodsport]

Map restrictions ftw. Nuff said.

Helpful and informative.

http://youtu.be/uaPWwyC6CDI

[SleepKiller]

Map restrictions ftw. Nuff said.

Helpful and informative.

http://youtu.be/uaPWwyC6CDI

Yeah, I just click on random links made with a tiny URL site...

[V-Man]

You have to remember that Cube 1 maps aren't truly 3D.

Someone explain this notion to me. Is this referring to the way lighting is done, that each cube's(And entity's) position on the X&Y axes is locked, both, or something else?

From what I can see in the map engine, that's basically it.

Here's how I understand it. It may not be totally correct (though I couldn't tell you where), but it has made my brain hurt less to think about it in these terms.
The information about each map (.cgz file) is basically 2-dimensional, with cubes and entities having a mysterious property referred to as "height." Treating height like an exotic property allows the cgz files to save dramatic amounts of room, keeping them nice and compact, even for very large maps.
Once the map is plugged into the 3d-rendering engine of AssaultCube, however, the "height" property is interpreted as an additional z-axis for the viewer's eyes and voila! A 2-dimensional map is given a 3-dimensional interpretation. The price of interpreting height in this manner can be seen as an increase in graphics statistics -- client-side lag -- if too many entities and cubes display height. This is why having more solids and fewer mapmodels can eliminate lag: solids don't display height properties.
Hence, Cube 1 maps are basically 2-dimensional. Care should be taken to avoid saying that AssaultCube itself is 2-dimensional, however -- or else the players wouldn't be able to jump up onto the platforms.

[tempest]

@Mael:
First off, lights in Cube 1 are not spheres, they're vertical cylinders. So obviously, if you place a light near the bottom of a high wall, you get the exact same lighting at the top of the wall, and the same lighting on the ceiling as on the floor.

Secondly, and this is probably the worst problem, is the occlusion calculation. That was never meant to deal with "vertical" maps. You might know this from @camper and friends - if you look straight up and move forward, you'll see missing layers of cubes appearing on the walls in "waves". There are additional issues with solid walls, because their occlusion works horizontally as well.

[Alien]

you have to create more complex benchmarks for the engine than map with few rooms. If you optimize engine with small rooms, one map with bigger room can corrupt your game. There are more restrictions which are out of sense "engine limitations". All we know the engine can handle all these maps, only you just don't want. In the game there were always people who wanted FPS and others who wanted to explore maps from various authors.

Three years the game is flooded with maps in limits of Cube 1 map editor (it means large maps, high maps and entity free) and now you decide everything is wrong. :) Come on ! Your limits create boring FPS with similar variations of maps.

[Nightmare]

1) Maps outside of the restrictions lag a lot. The only people who want to play on maps with 100 fps+ less than normal are the noobs jumping off megatowers thinking they are cool.

2) And maps like rattrap are still huge fps killers, and that's an OFFICIAL map. The map restrictions could be a lot more restricting if the devs wanted to keep top fps performance. These are rather lenient and easy to handle. I make Arena maps(douze-esque) a lot and still very rarely have problems with restrictions.

3) Sauerbraten has no restrictions and a "better" map editor, people can go map there instead. :)

<3 <---

[Lantry]

Why hasn't anyone yet threatened to leave if the map restrictions aren't enacted?
Discuss.

[Cleaner]

* Cleaner wonder why people want things that the engine just can't handle.

When is it they'll understand that restrictions aren't actually restrictions at all?
These "measures" have come up with the proper understanding of the engine's capabilities and therefore should be welcomed since it makes the game running more smoothly for ALL!

If you want to play immensely huge maps and complain of lag fair enough but not on the MS.

[Bloodsport]

If you want to play immensely huge maps and complain of lag fair enough but not on the MS.

I couldn't agree more. That's why I have been requesting that the devs make it easier for people to run unresstricted servers outside of the master server. Everyone wins!

[Nightmare]

Cleaner is lyinggggg
Megatowers is so creative.
stop killing my creativity with these prison cells you call map restrictions, man!!!!

:3

[Cleaner]

Cleaner is lyinggggg
Megatowers is so creative.
stop killing my creativity with these prison cells you call map restrictions, man!!!!

:3

I have never mentioned creativity in my post and tbh creativity is way much teased when confined to only a few tools.

This is not about creativity anyway it is merely about what is sustainable to the engine focal rendering.

[shad-99]

[SELECT ALL] Code:

These "measures" have come up with the proper understanding of the engine's capabilities and therefore should be welcomed since it makes the game running more smoothly for ALL!

Solution:

1. come up with a better engine then?

2. stop messing with peoples creativity

3. listen to what gamers want and not the closed society?

-Let every one have fun instead of f*** them

This arguments really suck about the engine shit?.. -and u can't please every ones hardware.. -people simply have to change hardware and graphicscard to run a proper game with out lag.

[tempest]

See, with posts like that you make even those favor the idea of map restrictions who normally wouldn't give a toss.
Here's the deal: You're more than welcome to come up with a better engine yourself if you want to play on your crapmaps. You're telling us that the arguments concerning technical limitations suck - are you sure you actually understood them? Also, maybe you want to pay new hardware for all those who don't have it?
Seriously.