Weapon stats.

[RKTnoob]

Weapons switch is 400ms for all weapons.
x/y is hp/armour, ">" indicates weapon switch.
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MTP-57 Assault Rifle

speed: 120ms
damage: 22
spread: 18
reloads in: 2000ms
starts with: 20/40
max ammo: 20/60
ammo per pickup: 40

100/100 87/91 73/83 59/75 45/67 30/60 15/53 0/0 (720ms)
100/75 86/67 71/60 56/53 41/46 25/40 8/35 0/0 (720ms)
100/50 85/43 69/37 52/32 34/28 15/25 0/0 (600ms)
100/25 81/22 62/19 42/17 22/15 1/14 0/0 (600ms)
100/0 78/0 56/0 34/0 12/0 0/0 (480ms)

Pistol combos:

1A+8P: 100/100 87/91>76/84 64/78 52/72 40/66 28/60 16/54 3/49 0/0 (1520ms)
2A+6P: 100/100 87/91 73/83>61/77 49/71 37/65 25/59 13/53 0/0 (1320ms)
3A+5P: 100/100 87/91 73/83 59/75>47/69 35/63 23/57 11/51 0/0 (1280ms)
4A+4P: 100/100 87/91 73/83 59/75 45/67>33/61 21/55 8/50 0/0 (1240ms)
5A+3P: 100/100 87/91 73/83 59/75 45/67 30/60>18/54 5/49 0/0 (1200ms)
6A+2P: 100/100 87/91 73/83 59/75 45/67 30/60 15/53>2/48 0/0 (1160ms)

1A+7P: 100/75 86/67>74/61 62/55 49/50 36/45 23/40 9/36 0/0 (1360ms)
2A+6P: 100/75 86/67 71/60>59/54 46/49 33/44 20/39 6/35 0/0 (1320ms)
3A+5P: 100/75 86/67 71/60 56/53>43/48 30/43 17/38 3/34 0/0 (1280ms)
4A+3P: 100/75 86/67 71/60 56/53 41/46>28/41 14/37 0/0 (1080ms)
5A+2P: 100/75 86/67 71/60 56/53 41/46 25/40>11/36 0/0 (1040ms)
6A+1P: 100/75 86/67 71/60 56/53 41/46 25/40 8/35>0/0 (1000ms)

1A+6P:100/50 85/43>72/38 58/34 43/31 28/28 13/25 0/0 (1200ms)
2A+5P:100/50 85/43 69/37>55/33 40/30 25/27 10/24 0/0 (1160ms)
3A+4P:100/50 85/43 69/37 52/32>37/29 22/26 6/24 0/0 (1120ms)
4A+3P:100/50 85/43 69/37 52/32 34/28>19/25 3/23 0/0 (1080ms)
5A+1P:100/50 85/43 69/37 52/32 34/28 15/25>0/0 (1040ms)

1A+5P: 100/25 81/22>65/20 49/18 32/17 15/16 0/0 (1040ms)
2A+4P: 100/25 81/22 62/19>46/17 29/16 12/15 0/0 (1000ms)
3A+3P: 100/25 81/22 62/19 42/17>25/16 8/15 0/0 (960ms)
4A+2P: 100/25 81/22 62/19 42/17 22/15>5/14 0/0 (920ms)
5A+1P: 100/25 81/22 62/19 42/17 22/15 1/14>0/0 (1040ms)

1A+5P: 100/0 78/0>60/0 42/0 24/0 6/0 0/0 (1040ms)
2A+4P: 100/0 78/0 56/0>38/0 20/0 2/0 0/0 (1000ms)
3A+2P: 100/0 78/0 56/0 34/0>16/0 0/0 (800ms)
4A+1P: 100/0 78/0 56/0 34/0 12/0>0/0 (760ms)

Knife combos:

4A+1K: 100/100 87/91 73/83 59/75 45/67>0/0 (760ms)
4A+1K: 100/75 86/67 71/60 56/53 41/46>0/0 (760ms)
4A+1K: 100/50 85/43 69/37 52/32 34/28>0/0 (760ms)
3A+1K: 100/25 81/22 62/19 42/17>0/0 (640ms)
3A+1K: 100/0 78/0 56/0 34/0>0/0 (640ms)

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A-ARD/10 Submachine Gun

speed: 80ms
damage: 16
spread: 45
reloads in: 1650ms
starts with: 30/60
max ammo: 30/90
ammo per pickup: 60

100/100 90/94 80/88 70/82 60/76 49/71 38/66 27/61 16/56 5/51 0/0 (720ms)
100/75 89/70 78/65 67/60 56/55 45/50 34/45 22/41 10/37 0/0 (640ms)
100/50 89/45 77/41 65/37 52/34 39/31 26/28 12/26 0/0 (560ms)
100/25 86/23 72/21 58/19 43/18 28/17 13/16 0/0 (480ms)
100/0 84/0 68/0 53/0 36/0 20/0 4/0 0/0 (480ms)

Pistol combos:

1S+8P: 100/100 90/94>79/87 67/81 55/75 43/69 31/63 19/57 7/51 0/0 (1520ms)
2S+7P: 100/100 90/94 80/88>69/81 57/75 45/69 33/63 21/57 9/51 0/0 (1440ms)
3S+6P: 100/100 90/94 80/88 70/82>58/76 46/70 24/64 22/58 10/52 0/0 (1360ms)
4S+5P: 100/100 90/94 80/88 70/82 60/76>48/70 36/64 24/58 12/52 0/0 (1280ms)
5S+4P: 100/100 90/94 80/88 70/82 60/76 49/71>37/65 25/59 13/53 0/0 (1200ms)
6S+4P: 100/100 90/94 80/88 70/82 60/76 49/71 38/66>26/60 14/54 1/49 0/0 (1280ms)
7S+3P: 100/100 90/94 80/88 70/82 60/76 49/71 38/66 27/61>15/55 2/50 0/0 (1200ms)
8S+2P: 100/100 90/94 80/88 70/82 60/76 49/71 38/66 27/61 16/56>3/51 0/0 (1120ms)
9S+1P: 100/100 90/94 80/88 70/82 60/76 49/71 38/66 27/61 16/56 5/51>0/0 (1040ms)

1S+7P: 100/75 89/70>77/64 65/58 53/52 40/47 27/42 13/38 0/0 (1360ms)
2S+7P: 100/75 89/70 78/65>66/59 54/53 41/48 28/43 15/38 1/34 0/0 (1440ms)
3S+6P: 100/75 89/70 78/65 67/60>55/54 42/49 29/44 16/39 2/35 0/0 (1360ms)
4S+5P: 100/75 89/70 78/65 67/60 56/55>43/50 30/45 17/40 3/36 0/0 (1280ms)
5S+4P: 100/75 89/70 78/65 67/60 56/55 45/50>32/45 19/40 5/36 0/0 (1200ms)
6S+3P: 100/75 89/70 78/65 67/60 56/55 45/50 34/45>21/40 7/36 0/0 (1120ms)
7S+2P: 100/75 89/70 78/65 67/60 56/55 45/50 34/45 22/41>8/37 0/0 (1040ms)
8S+1P: 100/75 89/70 78/65 67/60 56/55 45/50 34/45 22/41 10/37>0/0 (960ms)

1S+7P: 100/50 89/45>76/40 62/36 48/32 33/29 18/26 2/24 0/0 (1360ms)
2S+6P: 100/50 89/45 77/41>63/37 49/33 34/30 19/27 4/24 0/0 (1280ms)
3S+5P: 100/50 89/45 77/41 65/37>51/33 36/30 21/27 6/24 0/0 (1200ms)
4S+4P: 100/50 89/45 77/41 65/37 52/34>37/31 22/28 7/25 0/0 (1120ms)
5S+3P: 100/50 89/45 77/41 65/37 52/34 39/31>24/28 9/25 0/0 (1040ms)
6S+2P: 100/50 89/45 77/41 65/37 52/34 39/31 26/28>11/25 0/0 (960ms)
7S+1P: 100/50 89/45 77/41 65/37 52/34 39/31 26/28 12/26>0/0 (880ms)

1S+6P: 100/25 86/23>70/21 54/19 38/17 21/16 4/15 0/0 (1200ms)
2S+5P: 100/25 86/23 72/21>56/19 40/17 23/16 6/15 0/0 (1120ms)
3S+4P: 100/25 86/23 72/21 58/19>42/17 25/16 8/15 0/0 (1040ms)
4S+3P: 100/25 86/23 72/21 58/19 43/18>26/17 9/16 0/0 (960ms)
5S+2P: 100/25 86/23 72/21 58/19 43/18 28/17>11/16 0/0 (880ms)
6S+1P: 100/25 86/23 72/21 58/19 43/18 28/17 13/16>0/0 (800ms)

1S+5P: 100/0 84/0>66/0 48/0 30/0 12/0 0/0 (1040ms)
2S+4P: 100/0 84/0 68/0>50/0 32/0 14/0 0/0 (960ms)
3S+3P: 100/0 84/0 68/0 53/0>35/0 17/0 0/0 (880ms)
4S+2P: 100/0 84/0 68/0 53/0 36/0>18/0 0/0 (800ms)
5S+2P: 100/0 84/0 68/0 53/0 36/0 20/0>2/0 0/0 (880ms)
6S+1P: 100/0 84/0 68/0 53/0 36/0 20/0 4/0>0/0 (800ms)

Knife combos:

5S+1K: 100/100 90/94 80/88 70/82 60/76 49/71>0/0 (720ms)
5S+1K: 100/75 89/70 78/65 67/60 56/55 45/50>0/0 (720ms)
5S+1K: 100/50 89/45 77/41 65/37 52/34 39/31>0/0 (720ms)
4S+1K: 100/25 86/23 72/21 58/19 43/18>0/0 (640ms)
4S+1K: 100/0 84/0 68/0 53/0 36/0>0/0 (640ms)

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TMP-M&A Carbine

speed: 720ms
damage: 60
pierces armour by: 40%
spread: 10
reloads in: 1800ms
starts with: 10/20
max ammo: 10/30
ammo per pickup: 15

100/100 54/76 7/54 0/0 (1440ms)
100/75 53/53 4/34 0/0 (1440ms)
100/50 51/31 0/0 (720ms)
100/25 45/16 0/0 (720ms)
100/0 40/0 0/0 (720ms)

Pistol combos:

1C+5P: 100/100 54/76>42/70 30/64 18/58 6/52 0/0 (1040ms)
2C+1P: 100/100 54/76 7/54>0/0 (1280ms)

1C+4P: 100/75 53/53>40/48 27/43 14/38 0/0 (880ms)
2C+1P: 100/75 53/53 4/34>0/0 (1120ms)

1C+4P: 100/50 51/31>36/28 21/25 5/23 0/0 (880ms)

1C+3P: 100/25 45/16>28/15 11/14 0/0 (720ms)

1C+3P: 100/0 40/0>22/0 4/0 0/0 (720ms)

Knife combos:

2C+1K: 100/100 54/76 7/54>0/0 (1120ms)
2C+1K: 100/75 53/53 4/34>0/0 (1120ms)
1C+1k: 100/25 45/16>0/0 (400ms)
1C+1k: 100/0 40/0>0/0 (400ms)

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Precision Tech AD-81 Sniper Rifle

speed: 1500ms
damage: 82
pierces armour by: 25%
spread: 50 (0 while scoping)
reloads in: 1950ms
starts with: 5/15
max ammo: 5/15
ammo per pickup: 10

100/100 42/67 0/0 (1500ms)
100/75 40/54 0/0 (1500ms)
100/50 38/23 0/0 (1500ms)
100/25 27/12 0/0 (1500ms)
100/0 18/0 0/0 (1500ms)

Pistol combos:

1S+4P: 100/100 42/67> 30/61 18/55 5/50 0/0 (880ms)

1S+3P: 100/75 40/45>27/40 13/36 0/0 (720ms)

1S+3P: 100/50 38/23>22/21 6/19 0/0 (720ms)

1S+2P: 100/25 27/12>10/11 0/0 (560ms)

1S+1P: 100/0 18/0>0/0 (400ms)

Knife combos:

1S+1K: 100/100 42/67>0/0 (400ms)
1S+1K: 100/75 40/54>0/0 (400ms)
1S+1K: 100/50 38/23>0/0 (400ms)
1S+1K: 100/25 27/12>0/0 (400ms)
1S+1K: 100/0 18/0>0/0 (400ms)

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Mk-77 Semi-Automatic Pistol

speed: 160ms
damage: 18
spread: 53
reloads in: 1400ms
starts with: 10/50
max ammo: 10/90
ammo per pickup: 20

100/100 89/93 79/86 66/80 54/74 42/68 30/62 18/56 5/51 0/0 (1280ms)
100/75 88/69 76/63 64/57 52/51 39/46 26/41 12/37 0/0 (1120ms)
100/50 87/45 74/40 60/36 46/32 31/29 16/26 0/0 (960ms)
100/25 84/23 68/21 52/19 36/17 19/16 2/15 0/0 (960ms)
100/0 82/0 64/0 46/0 28/0 10/0 0/0 (800ms)

Knife combos:

5P+1K: 100/100 89/93 79/86 66/80 54/74 42/68>0/0 (1040ms)
5P+1K: 100/75 88/69 76/63 64/57 52/51 39/46>0/0 (1040ms)
4P+1K: 100/50 87/45 74/40 60/36 46/32>0/0 (880ms)
4P+1K: 100/25 84/23 68/21 52/19 36/17>0/0 (880ms)
3P+1K: 100/0 82/0 64/0 46/0>0/0 (720ms)

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V-19 Combat Shotgun

speed: 880ms
damage: 0-155
spread: 45-75
reloads in: 2400ms
starts with: 7/21
max ammo: 7/21
ammo per pickup: 14

(Numbers are for point blank range, maximum damage)
100/100 8/37 0/0 (880ms)
100/75 2/18 0/0 (880ms)
100/50 0/0 (0ms)
100/25 0/0 (0ms)
100/0 0/0 (0ms)

Pistol combos:

1S+1P: 100/100 8/37>0/0 (400ms)

1S+1P: 100/75 2/18>0/0 (400ms)

Knife combos:

1S+1K: 100/100 8/37>0/0 (400ms)
1S+1K: 100/75 2/18>0/0 (400ms)

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Swiss Tech Combat Blade DR-88

speed: 500ms
damage: 50
pierces armour by: 100%

100/100 50/80 0/0 (500ms)
100/75 50/57 0/0 (500ms)
100/50 50/34 0/0 (500ms)
100/25 50/17 0/0 (500ms)
100/0 50/0 0/0 (500ms)

Pistol combos:

1K+5P: 100/100 50/80>38/74 26/68 14/32 2/56 0/0 (1040ms)

1K+4P: 100/75 50/57>38/51 25/46 12/41 0/0 (880ms)

1K+4P: 100/50 50/34>35/31 20/28 5/25 0/0 (880ms)

1K+3P: 100/25 50/17>33/16 16/15 0/0 (720ms)

1K+3P: 100/0 50/0>32/0 14/0 0/0 (720ms)

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SAL-T3 Grenade
speed: 1000ms
damage: 2000

starts with: 0
max ammo: 3
ammo per pickup: 1 (1-2 in LSS)

(numbers are for a target that is standing exactly on the grenade)
100/100 4/37 0/0 (1000ms)
100/75 0/0 (0ms)
100/50 0/0 (0ms)
100/25 0/0 (0ms)
100/0 0/0 (0ms)

Pistol combo:

1G+1P: 100/100 4/37>0/0 (400ms)

Knife combo:

1G+1K: 100/100 4/37>0/0 (400ms)

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Akimbo

speed: 80ms
damage: 19
reloads in: 1400ms
spread: 50
starts with: 20/100
max ammo: 20/100
ammo per pickup: 20/100

100/100 88/93 76/86 64/79 52/72 39/66 26/60 13/54 0/0 (560ms)
100/75 88/68 75/62 62/56 49/50 36/44 22/39 7/35 0/0 (560ms)
100/50 87/44 73/39 58/35 43/31 27/28 11/25 0/0 (480ms)
100/25 84/22 67/20 50/18 33/16 15/15 0/0 (400ms)
100/0 81/0 62/0 43/0 24/0 5/0 0/0 (400ms)

Knife combos:

5A+1K: 100/100 88/93 76/86 64/79 52/72 39/66>0/0 (720ms)
4A+1K: 100/75 88/68 75/62 62/56 49/50>0/0 (640ms)
4A+1K: 100/50 87/44 73/39 58/35 43/31>0/0 (640ms)
3A+1K: 100/25 84/22 67/20 50/18>0/0 (560ms)
3A+1K: 100/0 81/0 62/0 43/0>0/0 (560ms)

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Special thanks to jamz for the answers!

[Ronald_Reagan]

I made a JS tool once to play around with weapon balance. Located here: http://test.bcfh.eu/assaultcube/damagecalculator.html

I'll update it with the most recent weapon stats here in a second. Is updated.

Your analysis of weapon combos is interesting! I never broached the subject of switching to pistol with my studies into weapon balance.

[RKTnoob]

Your tool looks nice, too bad I didn't know about it earlier, might have saved me some work. My post does lack akimbo combos, so if anyone feels the need, be my guest.

[Felix-The-Ghost]

I still think switch times and mobility of having a certain weapon in your loadout would make them easier to balance.
e.g. strong sniper but much slower and heavier than smg.

[Bukz]

Felix come home.

[RKTnoob]

Weapon balance is a tricky thing, and the current balance is what it is, and it's not gonna change until the next release, but if you ask me, the carbine is kinda sucky.

[Ronald_Reagan]

I'm honestly not sure why people think the carbine is bad. Its a pretty good weapon imo. What make it so useless to people? Is it more of the fact that people haven't learned how to use it yet?

[RKTnoob]

Carbine:
100/100 54/76 7/54 0/0 (1440ms)
100/75 53/53 4/34 0/0 (1440ms)
100/50 51/31 0/0 (720ms)
100/25 45/16 0/0 (720ms)
100/0 40/0 0/0 (720ms)

Pistol:
100/100 89/93 79/86 66/80 54/74 42/68 30/62 18/56 5/51 0/0 (1280ms)
100/75 88/69 76/63 64/57 52/51 39/46 26/41 12/37 0/0 (1120ms)
100/50 87/45 74/40 60/36 46/32 31/29 16/26 0/0 (960ms)
100/25 84/23 68/21 52/19 36/17 19/16 2/15 0/0 (960ms)
100/0 82/0 64/0 46/0 28/0 10/0 0/0 (800ms)

...and if you miss a shot with the carbine it's bye bye, while you might still survive if you miss one with the pistol. I'm not saying it's all bad, but if instead of 54, 53 and 51, in the first three line of the carbine could somehow be 50 maybe it could be comboed with a knife?

[#M|A#Wolf]

I'm honestly not sure why people think the carbine is bad. Its a pretty good weapon imo. What make it so useless to people? Is it more of the fact that people haven't learned how to use it yet?

It's impractical and useless to use it in highly competitive matches.

[Undead]

I'm honestly not sure why people think the carbine is bad. Its a pretty good weapon imo. What make it so useless to people? Is it more of the fact that people haven't learned how to use it yet?

sniper just feels a hundred times better.

carbine isn't useless in highly competitive matches unless you're bad with it, which is most people. its just that sniper is much better

[Ronald_Reagan]

So half of the reason is that nobody uses it, so nobody is good with it. The other half is that the sniper is better.

(Referring to the competitive scene)

[D3M0NW0LF]

B}, the Carbine Masters. :>

[RKTnoob]

I could run up a comparison between the carbine and other primary weapons, but it'd just be rehashing the numbers above. The truth is, the carbine is slow, and useful only in certain situations and as a support weapon, namely, killing stuff that moves and is already in mediocre health. It is also viable to use it as a hit and run weapon.

These situations arise mostly in pubs, that is, the more players that are in the game, the more chance you'll run into someone with poor health. In that case, you can punch his lights with a shot. I see it as a good weapon choice for arena type (douze anybody) maps, and deathmatch modes. How much of that is played, you can determine for yourself.

Comparing it ti the AR, it looses at everything except on very long ranges, due to the AR having a bit of a spread, but it'd have to be a very long range to get the carbine up top there, and from what I know, mappers are discouraged from making such maps.

Comparing it to the SMG, again, like the AR, the longer the range, the better the carbine looks. As mentioned somewhere before, you can peek a corner, shoot a SMG user, hide back, then pop out after 720ms and finish him off. The SMG and AR users require more line of sight than that, so it's a way to play the carbine.

Comparing it to the shotgun is a bit hard, as the shotgun has variable damage, tho it's easy to see that the longer the range the better the carbine is. You could even say that the shotty is pretty much the opposite of the carbine. Thing is, the shotty will give you more points for gibs, and it's a way much easier comboing it. I'm not mentionig that the shotty can and will instant one-shot you in hands of experienced users.

Comparing it to the sniper, well, there's not much to say here, the sniper has headshots, gibs, best combos, fastest combo (400ms, and that is on par with the Akimbo) and is better at long ranges due to scope and zero spread. Carbine has somee advantage up close here, due to the sniper having no crosshair.

IMO killsteal and hit&run looks like the way to play it. On the other hand, I played just a few games with it, so what do I know. I'm sure a Carbine expert could provide a better insight in it than me. I don't know any except br!tney, so if he could provide a sentence or two, that'd be great.

As a side note, knife tops the carbine in raw numbers, and the pistol is thereabouts, even if they're both secondary weapons.

Weapon balance should be balance, and I don't see how the carbine has a realistic chance to stand on even grounds with other weapons. And even if my opinion is incorrect, take any given game and count the number of carbine users. People just don't play it, and I'm pretty sure it's for a reason.

[Undead]

So half of the reason is that nobody uses it, so nobody is good with it. The other half is that the sniper is better.

(Referring to the competitive scene)

no, i used it extensively, and probably better than anyone else. its just that sniper and carbine fill basically the exact same niche and sniper does it better. the one circumstance i can think of where carbine would be preferable would be on the armour stacked side of elevation, but even then smg/shotgun is usually better there.

maybe its just preferential, i don't know, but i personally find sniper to be far superior to carbine.

B}, the Carbine Masters. :>

using the weapon doesn't make you the master of it.

[Roflcopter]

Balance the core weapons: currently SMG, shotgun and sniper.
Then make AR like SMG but with less spread, more recoil, more kickback, slightly less damage/s.
Make carbine like sniper but faster firing, no scope, less damage.

Also how about a sniper that doesn't kill faster than AR/SMG? Sniper is supposed to gain its advantage from chip-and-hide, not full-power attacks.

[RKTnoob]

Also I would like world peace.

[Marti]

[RKTnoob]

Is there a way to get some statistical data from the players? And not just for the carbine, but for all weapons. Hard numbers are hard numbers after all.

[Ronald_Reagan]

Like what kind of statistical data? Usage amount?

[RKTnoob]

The more the better!

Weapon accuracy, hs count for snipers, gib kills for shotgun, kill steals per weapon, team kills per weapon, average times reloaded per weapon, average bullets left in clip before reload, average distance to target, average bullets spent per frag, average frags per life, which weapon was used the most, number of weapon picks per match, the more the merrier!