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aG will be hosting ACWC 2012 this summer.
The main purpose at this stage is just to get rules finalised and decide a starting date. Due to the fact many will be taking vacation around the time of ACWC it's important we run it at a time when the most players will be available.
ACWC 2012 should take five or six weeks from the starting date. We won't be able to extend deadlines for this tournament since players may then not be able to play due to going on vacation.
Click here for the first draft (and then post your comments below or in the thread!)
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Ahh to bad it's single elimination. Overall good draft.
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Sounds good to me. My guess as for when the tournament starts would be possibly towards the end of the first week of July.
One thing you could do, is add bobs match server to the list.
bob-ac.co.uk 13013
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25 Apr 12, 11:16PM
(This post was last modified: 25 Apr 12, 11:20PM by ExodusS.)
Spectating was the fail of the last tournament, looks like you didn't learn your lessons.
Spectators can use TemaSpeak/Mumble/Skype to give precious informations to their teamates.
Benched players can spectate with a "free view" so they are spectating like real spectators (yes, the "benchme" command is a big fail, you are not have to be locked on teamates views), so they can give precious informations too.
PFF
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(25 Apr 12, 11:16PM).ExodusS* Wrote: Benched players can spectate with a "free view" so they are spectating like real spectators (yes, the "benchme" command is a big fail, you are not have to be locked on teamates views), so they can give precious informations too. How about reporting such things as a bug/feature request, instead of making us pick them out of a bunch of angry ramblings?
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26 Apr 12, 12:25AM
(This post was last modified: 26 Apr 12, 12:33AM by Roflcopter.)
(25 Apr 12, 11:16PM).ExodusS* Wrote: Spectating was the fail of the last tournament, looks like you didn't learn your lessons.
This isn't that we don't recognize the issue, simply that we have no alternative. If we don't allow substitutes it may delay the match at critical moments. Benching is the best we can do until it's fixed by the devs.
I'd also like to point out the same situation that happened to AW also happened to aG in the round we were knocked out.
(25 Apr 12, 10:34PM)bballn45 Wrote: Ahh to bad it's single elimination. Overall good draft.
I agree double elimination tends to be fairer (look at how oNe did in the aG Cup) but time restraints and a desire to keep things similar to previous years were the reasons I decided not to use double elimination ultimately.
Also, I just wanted to say, make sure to vote for all dates you can play, not just your preferred date. Thank you!
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Good rules;3
ExodusS, bad luck dude, if you really think some suss stuff is happeneing file a complaint and the admins can more then likely look @ it and if theirs anything as suspicious as obvious walling etc. the admins can easily revert the match.
Rofl could also perhaps make an ACWC part of the woop ts where all teams that have specs must be in that channel. For example, The Australia team would have a public and match channel. While in match, only 3 may be in the match channel but if subs may happen, the other Aus player must join the channel ts and then start or something?
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(26 Apr 12, 12:54AM)Xenon Wrote: ExodusS, bad luck dude, if you really think some suss stuff is happeneing file a complaint and the admins can more then likely look @ it and if theirs anything as suspicious as obvious walling etc. the admins can easily revert the match.
We did consider it at the time but there was no solid evidence to support it.
(26 Apr 12, 12:54AM)Xenon Wrote: Rofl could also perhaps make an ACWC part of the woop ts where all teams that have specs must be in that channel. For example, The Australia team would have a public and match channel. While in match, only 3 may be in the match channel but if subs may happen, the other Aus player must join the channel ts and then start or something?
Whatever arrangement you have in various private servers no one can be sure you're not using another server/ application for additional chat. I appreciate your attempt to find a solution, though I think it's impossible.
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Not sure I agree with the exclusion of maps. If those are on there, then add douze to it as well.
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(26 Apr 12, 03:58AM)Ronald_Reagan Wrote: Not sure I agree with the exclusion of maps. If those are on there, then add douze to it as well.
The reason ac_arabian is banned is because it's apparently broken in some Mac builds of AC. I'd consider ac_arid and ac_aqueous the two most biased CTF maps myself and don't personally see ac_douze as much more biased than ac_gothic or ac_ingress.
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But you switch teams. They are biased though. ac_arabian can be fixed if the mac users aren't lazy (unlike me). ac_toxic also needs fixing for macs. Basically you just need to update the map file and you are good to go.
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toxic doesnt play with CTF.
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I didn't know. I don't remember the last time I played it |:D
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People would be pretty mad if arabian was picked (I would).
Rules seem legit. Maybe an amendment should be made in addition to the one's that already exist about spectator chatting and talk in general during the match except through teamchat? I don't know how this would be implemented well as both teams need to talk to each other, but from what I saw from commenting a lot of the games for the aG* cup, there was far more shit-talking then necessary.
As far as benched members go, I agree with Larry. With no alternative, it seems like you'll just have to trust players *gasp* to not be complete asswipes and try and cheat through ghosting. Yes it has been done in the past, but maybe we can set up a dedicated teamspeak/mumble/skype/whatever situation where the referee can monitor all channels and make sure that only the people actively playing are in the channels at that time. BoB, w00p, FD, and MyS all have servers and I'm sure that BoB and others would gladly provide channels for the acwc.
cheers rofl and aG* for setting this up
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26 Apr 12, 10:03AM
(This post was last modified: 26 Apr 12, 10:04AM by ExodusS.)
ac_douze was picked on the last tournament, it was a troll pick you know?
Btw: Xenon all your arguments are invalids, or maybe you know we can connect to 2 different Teamspeak server in the same time.
Btw: in your rules you accept spectators too... but ACtv will certainly be ON, so in first, spectators not allowed, someone have a problem with it or you all want to fight on the IRC to know who will have the chance to stay on the 12 slots server?
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refs can also connect to as many servers as they like exoduss, and it shouldn't be hard to visually see where the players are all talking. In fact, when playing, it can be made sure that the players are only connected to one channel. It shouldn't be that hard for a ref to keep tabs on 6 players at a time. and if you're that concerned about what everybody is doing, might I suggest you yourself try and ref? that way you can be certain everything goes according to your plan.
actv will be involved i'm sure. I assume the servers involved with have slots adequate for two teams of 5 as well as 1 ref and at least 2 others for stream/cast. for a total of 13. Maybe servers can be modified (easily i might add) to allow 15 players if good solid numbers are your thing.
Any issue can be solved with a little bit of common sense and the willingness of participants to not be overly cynical.
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26 Apr 12, 10:43AM
(This post was last modified: 26 Apr 12, 10:43AM by Terran.)
(26 Apr 12, 10:27AM)Waffles Wrote: refs can also connect to as many servers as they like exoduss, and it shouldn't be hard to visually see where the players are all talking. In fact, when playing, it can be made sure that the players are only connected to one channel...
I understand what you're trying to say here but you can't keep 100% tabs on someone unless you're physically standing behind them. Different hot-keys, separate communication programs, there are way too many ways to keep your conversations private. Heck, they could just call each other on the phone.
However, I think what ExodusS needs to understand is that there's no way to completely prevent this. Period.
Just play fairly and expect others to do the same.
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The point about biased map is useless since you play it on rvsf and cla.
For ts/mumble maybe if one referee were in the channel of the teams playing the match he could check if only 3 players are talking no?
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Roflcopter, just watching demos to see if someone is walling is easy enough.
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Drakas used an modified server, where he was able to freeze players, this would work great for subs, they couldnt spectate so.
Anf if a sub was needed, he unfroze one, all this worked with two simply commands.
Btw what do you think about allowing tdm, tosok, htf and (tktf) for the acwc, like 2010?
I just see one problem and thats the lag when playing tosok.
I also would recommend two or three maps (both sides) for the final and maybe already for the semi-final.
And if there are less than 16 teams, one country can have 2 teams, without any pre-elimination. Well, i hope that won`t be the case, i would like to see so many different countries as possible and maybe some old players from 0.93 and 1.0.4 , who are participating.
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ac_arid is biased, but riflesprinting both ways has its benefits.
However, even numbers should be used. If aqueous has to go, then maybe arid should as well.
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That's just too bad that clans are organising these kind of cups.
It's the job of AC Staff to host it on AC website.
I don't think the AC staff should be directly responsible for hosting a cup. Release cups, maybe.
For other games, gaming leagues such as ClanBase host nation cups. It's a shame that an AC team has to host it though. also, any mention of outside-the-team referees'?
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(26 Apr 12, 03:06PM)Harps Wrote: I don't think the AC staff should be directly responsible for hosting a cup. Release cups, maybe.
For other games, gaming leagues such as ClanBase host nation cups. It's a shame that an AC team has to host it though. also, any mention of outside-the-team referees'?
Yes, don't worry. There will be several referees from different teams.
(26 Apr 12, 01:04PM)Xenon Wrote: Roflcopter, just watching demos to see if someone is walling is easy enough.
I don't think it's as easy as you think. Wallhackers tend to be the hardest cheaters to catch.
(26 Apr 12, 01:06PM)Elite Wrote: Drakas used an modified server, where he was able to freeze players, this would work great for subs, they couldnt spectate so.
There are some modifications to UK MyS servers I've made to make things easier but I have no control over other servers so I don't think I can rely on these things being available.
(26 Apr 12, 01:06PM)Elite Wrote: Btw what do you think about allowing tdm, tosok, htf and (tktf) for the acwc, like 2010?
I just see one problem and thats the lag when playing tosok.
TDM has issues with players choosing to respawn slowly. TOSOK is very affected by lag like you say. HTF is fairly suitable I think. TKTF is way too random (based on spawns). Overall, I think it's best to focus on a single mode like last year but if it's highly desired to play multiple modes it can change.
(26 Apr 12, 01:06PM)Elite Wrote: And if there are less than 16 teams, one country can have 2 teams, without any pre-elimination. Well, i hope that won`t be the case, i would like to see so many different countries as possible and maybe some old players from 0.93 and 1.0.4 , who are participating.
Yes that's true.
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I agree with the idea of allowing more than one team per country represent. An example could be like if germany had two teams then they would play each other and instead of the loser getting eliminated, the loser would be team B and the winner team A. During the cup team As will be up againts team Bs so that the B teams will have to play their hardest. Having only one team per country imo is not that exciting since most countries e.g. australia have more than enough skilled players to make 2+ teams which just makes the cup more competitive and exciting.
$0.02
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I hope you'll make a website for the cup and do not use aG's forum.
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(27 Apr 12, 06:57AM)pweaks Wrote: I hope you'll make a website for the cup and do not use aG's forum.
I would actually love a permanent ACWC site, not those ones that come and go. But, if we cannot have that one, aG forum would be better solution than some disposable site. The reason is obvious, it will keep the data and results of the tournament for a longer period of time. Just in case, BoB will (as we did for awesome aG tournament) back up the results on the ladder.
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At least the results should be available on the ac wiki, since the server of drakas (acwc.woop.us) is down, i cant find old results of 2009 and 2010.
If you need help with well defined rules for a nations cup I would highly recommend looking at the ClanBase NC (the longest running and most well respected NC league, afaik) rules as a guide:
http://clanbase.ggl.com/rules.php?lid=12512
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