IAF nickname BL

[pakit]

a&d,now tyd blacklisted us on their servers.

what can we do? we do our best to proof we are onest guys,we do everything as it must be,cheaters are kicked from the clan.we don't have more cheaters in IAF than in other clan.look at oNe how many cheaters kicked from this clan and they are not BL? why?

i'm really tired of all this,all this energy put in this clan to be clean,onest,fair and respectable.

in return,what we have? only will to destruct us from a part of the community.
why all this hate against us?

what we did wrong? i really don't understand and be disappointed by all this.

tell us what you want from us or just ban us all pls but put an end at this pls :(

sadly highly angry and disappointed pakit.

[Matasar]

That really sad to hear and i hope they change their mind.

[ElCrema]

Well... Its relle strange in fact, that even kicking the cheaters, something that neither oNe or w00p did for all that matters you clan get blacklisted.
The double standards of quite a few members of this community aggravates the crap out of me.
Tbh honest I don't read the blacklist thread anymore, I'm not a big fan of wasting my time to keep an updated BL while cheating scum like life and P@nico roam free in two major clans of AC.
If Brahma's and jamz's anti-cheating detection system is not good enough to ban life I don't see why should it be to ban any other player. That whole attitude makes me easy to to see why oNe decided to take P@nico back and they might as well get Davi, Wof, Myster, Interwebz and many others. As it is today, AC's blacklist is one huge bad joke...

[V-Man]

That really sad to hear and i hope they change their mind.

Or at least put all the cards on the table.

[IAF|@cid]

Today i am writing here as @cid not IAF|@cid
This post is not to start a flamewar but still i being AC player thinks that there should be some proper way of handling Nick Blacklist.

1.)IAF kicked cheaters (Homer-J and Tiesto) We only received a butchered log still we took action as fast as we could.
2.)IAF stopped Marti from using our tag (Even when whole community is with Marti) We still waiting if someone gives us some proof if there is any.
3.)IAF never had any complaints from TyD clan about any incidents or cheat if they had ever reported to us or AC community same goes to A&D.
4.)Loosky was banned for some period he did as he been told.
5.)Kirin left the clan so no issue there also.
6.)For me other then these incidents we have no complaints for IAF. We are known for our good behavior and fare play (that what i was use to think).

I mean what else do you want from IAF.

You want us to close IAF Clan. In my personal opinion (Not a clan opinion) this actually is a well managed attempt to kick out IAF from the AC forever. We been criticized by some people for nothing. Why double standards here. Why politics in the game or this is just part of the game that i don't understand.

Tyd and A&D are server owner they have every right to keep them running way they want but still reason should be worth listening. I heard A&D reason also no point on argue on that but why TyD.

Thanks & Regards

@cid

[Andrez]

NVM....

[Drakas]

Good luck IAF.

w00p did for all that matters you clan get blacklisted.

... cheating scum like life

Surely you have heaps of evidence to back up your claim? ;)

Oh, and why isn't Kirin on your list?

[ketar]

1.)IAF kicked cheaters (Homer-J and Tiesto) We only received a butchered log still we took action as fast as we could.
2.)IAF stopped Marti from using our tag (Even when whole community is with Marti) We still waiting if someone gives us some proof if there is any.
3.)IAF never had any complaints from TyD clan about any incidents or cheat if they had ever reported to us or AC community same goes to A&D.
4.)Loosky was banned for some period he did as he been told.
5.)Kirin left the clan so no issue there also.
6.)For me other then these incidents we have no complaints for IAF. We are known for our good behavior and fare play (that what i was use to think).

By the way... Homer-J and Tiesto are not cheater at all, I received a letter from Aka, former IAF now R/d where he admits he was responsible of that event (I posted the letter on our forum and he should soon post it here).

Marti's affaire is still to be decided. So at the end there are only old facts: Loosky (who passed his troubles and payed for that and) and Kirin.

pwnage, stef, can we discuss in a civil way this?

John 8:7:
"He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her."

[Andrez]

John 8:7:
"He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her."

At least keep religion out of this, please...

[pwnage{TyD}]

"Tbh honest I don't read the blacklist thread anymore, I'm not a big fan of wasting my time to keep an updated BL while cheating scum like life and P@nico roam free in two major clans of AC."

Or that half of the servers out there hardly does use a blacklist. Those who uses it active and adds everything will simply not have their servers full often. Which is a shame seing that are many servers which are well configured don't get even a third of the traffic the most popular ones have. I've slowed down my contribution to the blacklist thread, which has been noticable. Those server owners that wants to use a blacklist and not do the work themselves can copy mine and use that.

You have a lot of good points there TheCrema. My intention was to bring out these questions in public

Panico was applying to oNe. I don't know why they would recruit a proven cheater.. but latest news is that he withdrawed his application.

<Panicow> I closed my app..

On another note, I find it interesting that Sepher (old |BC|Seperh) which was caught with aimbot are now on oNe's Urban Terror team. It's another game, but also something to think about.

UrT team:
Sepehr BunnySoul Undead and Mael

As far as I'm concerned there is no proof that Mati have done any cheating. Loosky had a temporary ban in the blacklist. Tiesto and Homer was removed promptly.

"IAF kicked cheaters (Homer-J and Tiesto)"

Every other clan would have done the same.

"In my personal opinion (Not a clan opinion) this actually is a well managed attempt to kick out IAF from the AC forever. "

"IAF kicked cheaters (Homer-J and Tiesto) We only received a butchered log still we took action as fast as we could."

It is very interesting that this log came out in public now and not in May (when it actually happened)?. Amazingly it became public just around the time IAF got nicknameblacklisted on A&D servers. Why this two months waiting?


IAF nickname blacklist entry is removed on TyD servers btw.

[IAF|@cid]

First thx for your removing the Nick blacklist

Second Log was give to lucas by drakas the moment that log came to my hand within 1 hour i posted there removal in AC forum after checking there IP on forum with the IP on log. I been criticized also for acting so fast by my own clan for that too :P.

Third i been waiting for whole log and demo so if i get that too i will post that for blacklist. I also mentioned this before.

Thx again

IAF|@cid

[pwnage{TyD}]

Second moment that log came to my hand within 1 hour i posted there removal in AC forum after checking there IP on forum with the IP on log. I been criticized also for acting so fast by my own clan for that too :P.

Like I said. They where removed promptly.
But my question was why you didn't recieve the log in May. There are two months between July and May.

[Drakas]

Second moment that log came to my hand within 1 hour i posted there removal in AC forum after checking there IP on forum with the IP on log. I been criticized also for acting so fast by my own clan for that too :P.

Like I said. They where removed promptly.
But my question was why you didn't recieve the log in May. There are two months between July and May.

I wasn't informed of that until last week.

[IAF|@cid]

You can ask drakas for that.
I have even request for this also http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCQKIbsrOko on hi-skill as i been told by shortyy and Blue-Print and still have not received any reply

[Drakas]

You can ask drakas for that.
I have even request for this also http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCQKIbsrOko on hi-skill as i been told by shortyy and Blue-Print and still have not received any reply

Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 2010 19:35:14 +0000
From: Drakas <[email protected]>
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 yyyy
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: IP

Hi @cid,

Here it is: *187.57.2.29*

Drakas

No?

[#M|A#Wolf]

now cookie... this is sad

[IAF|@cid]

Thx a lot but i have not received it yet :S
Could be typo but anyways thx.

@wolf :- sry to disappoint you he is impersonator :P there were two playing that day but error was confident on this one which turned out to be fake :P.
IAF|@cid

[Drakas]

Thx a lot but i have not received it yet :S
Could be typo but anyways thx.
IAF|@cid

I suggest you check your Spambox whenever you make a query. I respond to every query that has an e-mail address attached, and I do it as soon as I can (ie. when I have access to the logs)

[IAF|@cid]

You do more then enough for the community dude :)
Typo could be from my end might have typed in hurry :P i usually delete spams very fast i donno why i get so much spam. Could be coz this email is posted in many places :S.

Thx again

[ElCrema]

Good luck IAF.

w00p did for all that matters you clan get blacklisted.

... cheating scum like life

Surely you have heaps of evidence to back up your claim? ;)

No Drakas I don't, but neither did you to show us any proof that he is clean. Like I said to you before, my views on that matter are very clear: Or we accept that Brahma and jamz cheating detection detection are valid or we don't. We already talked about this and I will say now what I said to you before: If you have proof that life is clean, do you care to show us or at least say something about it of why did you guys took him back?
Becuse frankly, just come and say: Nah you screw you all, life is clean because we at w00p are saying so! Its not gonna cut it, mate.
I understand that most of your clan do not play AC much or have any contact with Brahma, jamz or the AC dev team, I understand that it must be hard for them to ban life based sole on the word of someone they don't even know let alone trust. But as you know very well their word was always good enough to ban many other players. What I would like to hear is: Why it is not, when it comes to w00p players?

[jamz]

*sigh*

I told Drakas that Homer-J or Tiesto/Wallace had used edit mode or a modified map, when I saw Homer-J in the Alps (IIRC) team for the World Cup. I didn't use the AC blacklist thread in May, because then the official policy on cheating was being turned around, and I was having a hissy fit at the injustice. Mea culpa.

I can't speak for A&D, but IAF are nick banned on my server for one reason - trust, or lack of. We know for a fact that Kirin/SolidSnake/Otto is an experienced and proven cheat, yet he is still a close 'friend' of the IAF clan. Until this situation changes, I see no reason to trust any member of the clan. The Homer-J/Tiesto/aka farce is similar. How can I trust what has been revealed as being the truth?
I've heard about or seen information pointing to 8 current IAF members cheating or having cheated; I have no proof to reveal, so see no reason to name names. When I was recently asked about information I had on current oNe members cheating, my answer was zero.

What this ultimately comes down to is choice. I can choose to ban whomsoever I wish, for whatever reason, and players can choose to play wherever they wish, provided they're not banned. As it is, most experienced players choose not to play on my server and that suits me fine.

ps - To set the record straight: Crema, I have had no part in the cheat detection code. AFAIK this has been the work of Brahma and Kirin only.

[Alien]

jamz if you recruit new people from game, you have no mechanism how protect against them, it can be some fucker behind the proxy using your trust and name, you shouldn't support these cheaters but the clan which support and grow up in AC. So i think that banning clan which solves the problem is something as "gj cheater, you are doing it good."

And i don't think that someone who spend so much time with catching cheaters, would say that to cheaters.

[Drakas]

No Drakas I don't, but neither did you to show us any proof that he is clean.

Speaks for itself :)...

I can send you at least a few dozen demos if you'd like!

so, Mr Crema.... prove 'us' you're clean then?

Actually, let's find a log...

--- Log opened Thu Feb 18 15:53:32 2010 A month before
15:53:32 -!- Irssi: Starting query in gamesurge with |oNe|Wolf
15:53:32 <|oNe|Wolf> hey Drakas, do you have time for me?
15:54:40 <Drakas> http://woop.us/2108
15:55:31 <|oNe|Wolf> sry for that, you probably know that Brahma bled me?
15:55:40 <Drakas> ja
15:55:57 <|oNe|Wolf> have you take a look at the demo or any other proof?
15:56:30 <Drakas> well, yes
15:56:43 <|oNe|Wolf> and what do you think?
15:57:01 <Drakas> didn't reach a conclusion

I'm sorry, but who are you to say you know what conclusions I reach myself?

Also, there's a different between making a claim and and saying that you believe something. The former makes you look like a fool if you can't back it up ;)

There's a difference between

21:53:21 <Drakas> anywho, my view (as an admin) is that anthrax and panico are cheaters.

and

<Crema> LIFE IS A CHEATER SCUMBAG CHEATER HARBORER

Anywho, don't put Brahma and jamz in the same box. jamz doesn't come up with proofs of aimbotting with things like "he couldn't make a 360 degree move like that when he's right-handed because the mouse would hit the keyboard". lol.

---

We know for a fact that Kirin/SolidSnake/Otto is an experienced and proven cheat, yet he is still a close 'friend' of the IAF clan. Until this situation changes, I see no reason to trust any member of the clan.

By that logic, you should see no reason to trust any member of the devteam?

[Brahma]

Drakas...

1) The "dev team" is not a clan, and does not play in tournaments or matches;

2) We work for free for this game, and try to satisfy the requests of the community;

3) The community is divided (part due to politics bullshit, like the one you are doing now... and those who just want to play good games);

4) Kirin cheated, confessed, and accepted its punishment. He is not IAF anymore, afaik. Dura lex sed lex. He is not the best person of the world, but also he is not the worst... you should give some value for his effort to make this game better in the same way I give value to your effort.

5) Life cheated... never confessed, never accepted his punishment, and he was never kicked from w00p.

6) I do not want to be part of this bullshit again... I do not want to watch demos... I do not want to play "political" games anymore... and I am giving you 40% of perm warn for trying to include my name in this.

[jamz]

...you have no mechanism how protect against them, it can be some[one] behind the proxy using your trust and name...

There are mechanisms. You ask players you trust. You research IP addresses. You read any server logs you can get your hands on. It may take me a long time, but I make damn sure that any accusations I make can be backed up with obvious proof. You weren't worried about the lack of mechanism when I gave you information about two aCKa players, both of whom silently left the clan shortly after.

...you shouldn't support these cheaters but the clan which support and grow up in AC...

The clan which recruited a known cheat (who modified the code himself, not using some lame download), then stays friendly with that cheat because of his "I'm sorry I got caught cheating three times. Please forgive me, I'll help you all I can." attitude? Sorry, but I'd rather lend my support to clans who have respect for the honest players.

By that logic, you should see no reason to trust any member of the devteam?

I see two reasons. Firstly, they are the inventors/maintainers/keepers of the game. Their opinions may not always follow mine, or even be for the best all the time, but those opinions are what form AC, the game I love. Who am I to argue with that?
Secondly, those developers, I hope, are intelligent enough to distance themselves from Kirin, keeping the relationship strictly 'professional'. They are using his knowledge of the code to enhance the game. The work with Kirin will ultimately (again, I hope) be for the better of AC, and as I said, I don't consider it my position to question this judgement.

[Alien]

I play AC, i am not police man. Your mechanism is too difficult. I am lazy even to watch my demos.

I understand, it is his 5 lines of code versus your 100 nights at logs, demos. It would piss off me too. I would suck dick every cheater who modify himself and do something against it in the same time. This one can do good job against hidden "pro" players with cheats in game. Banning is really useless.

About 4 aCKas who you mentioned, i still don't understand why you haven't put them to blacklist, you probably like aCKa clan. :) We solved it as friends, they told me why and they left.

[pakit]

I've heard about or seen information pointing to 8 current IAF members cheating or having cheated; I have no proof to reveal, so see no reason to name names. When I was recently asked about information I had on current oNe members cheating, my answer was zero.

sorry but are you serious? :s here is how you do? accuse,with no proof,no name only number based on secret info by your specials informer? :s

my special informer told me about 10 DES cheating....you think it's serious info? i can't give name.

pls :s something serious to say or only dreams? :s

at least a list?

you really disappoint me i was convicted you were a serious guy :s again i was wrong :s what a noob i am.

PS: thanks to people that support us :) and to pawnage for having remove the bl :) ty all guys :) hf cya in game ;)

[Drakas]

Brahma, I guess I won't talk about the situation because you cannot agree with me and I cannot agree with you. However, I am not the one who brought your name up. Press Ctrl+F and write "Brahma". It's Crema who brought your name up first.

I do not see why you should give me warning points, especially that I did not insult anybody. Crema, on the other hand insulted my friend in a public forum and you did absolutely nothing against that, whereas when you were insulted by another member a few months ago you took every action to ban him. I don't see how that's being fair since I did not bring your name up and I did not insult a single person. I do not see the need to insult anybody to make my argument and I believe that other people shouldn't.

I am not disrespecting your name and I am not the one who used it, so why should I take the blame? I didn't use your name in an argument which contains insulting words. I will stress again, I did not start the "politics bullshit" in this thread, so treat the one who did with the penalty!

It's facts, experience, knowledge and personality that talk. Unfortunately, as far as I'm aware, the community has now partially split into those who are completely blind and those who are not blind and stick to scepticism. The former category comprises of people who are either completely conforming with Brahma all the time ("Brahma is ultimate authority"), or people who are completely against him ("Brahma is full of nonsense"). The latter goes more along the lines "I'll see for myself" or "I don't really care, I like playing this game more than anything".

Neither of this former behaviour is healthy for the game and the community. I'm afraid that during the past year the number of people who stay sceptic without leaning to the "nonsense" side has decreased and will continue to do so. This is not temporary damage, this is permanent damage that nobody can undo any more and for this reason a significant percentage of players will absolutely doubt the work you are producing, and will be producing, whether it produces absolutely accurate results or not.

I still want to stay in the sceptic side, but constant pressure from people telling you what to do in your house makes it seem like there are people who will do anything to achieve that.

Sure, I'll refuse to play with certain guys from a certain clan that's been accused of harbouring, but I will not go chasing, insulting and harassing them every day for what they, in my opinion, have done. And I won't give someone, like a leader, who keeps their share of scepticism a hard time because they have their right to come to their own conclusions.

[ElCrema]

-edited: in his post directed to me, not the post above:

Drakas you said a lot, without saying anything...

You see Drakas, I have to reason to bash your clan or do personal attacks on any w00p player (but life). And that little quote of me that you put there does not reflect the true and you know it, no one here but you and I know what we talked in private about this whole case and if you can not see my point here, I'm sorry Mr. Drakas, but you are the fool, not me...
I'll keep saying what I said to you before: So far, all the blacklist entries from Brahma and jamz (that even without having nothing to do with the cheating detection code, has done some fine working at caught cheaters) were always good enough to AC community in recent history, the only case otherwise was when it came down to life.
I'm sorry, but when it comes to detect cheating Brahma's words worth quite more than w00p's, so unless some one shows otherwise, life's BL entry stands still. And as much as you wont like to admit it: your clan has someone that cheated in its ranks.

Anyhow, with AC 1.1 coming and the whole blacklist system changing, it was a very smart move from w00p to sweep all this dirt under the rug and pretend nothing ever happened. After all, nothing very drastic would occur apart from some dents in the clan's reputation among fellas that don't like hypocrisy like myself. But you guys have a bunch of servers, a very popular public ladder, you run all kinds of cool tournaments (thou without any punishment for players caught on doping before* ;) why the hell should you care about what myself of anyone else thinks? You do as you think is right, just remember what I said to you once Drakas, you gotta learn to pick your fight better and stand your ground, mate.

Since I imagine I made my point of view quite clear here and I'll say no more on this matter to not put anymore fuel on what seems to be, for most of AC players, a useless flame. Under the rug it is!
Lets just play this fine game and try to have some fun, can't wait for the official release of 1.1. Its looking good.

*sarcasm apart, very good job on the ACWC, btw.

[Mael]

Well... Its relle strange in fact, that even kicking the cheaters, something that neither oNe or w00p did for all that matters you clan get blacklisted.
The double standards of quite a few members of this community aggravates the crap out of me.

Serenity, Seagal, and Wolf were all kicked. Myster was bl'd after he left.

If Brahma's and jamz's anti-cheating detection system is not good enough to ban life I don't see why should it be to ban any other player.

This is a matter of the evidence provided and method of detection, not who the player is.

That whole attitude makes me easy to to see why oNe decided to take P@nico back

P@nico was never in oNe and he isn't now. He closed his app.

and they might as well get Davi, Wof, Myster, Interwebz and many others. As it is today, AC's blacklist is one huge bad joke...

You ought to work for Fox, the way you take the decision of a group of people and extrapolate it to such an extreme.

Lastly, your post has no relevance here. If want a podium to stand on and preach use IRC- don't hijack another's thread. You haven't contributed anything to the topic.

As for the IAF nicklisting I don't see reason for blocking the clan. From what I understand they've kicked the cheaters.