Weird bug ? can't vote my map with admins right

[Luc@s]

Hey all,
I recently edited a 1.0 map on 1.1.0.1. I did a lot of work on it. Someone asked me to show it so I tried to vote it on his server : "the server doesn't have the map". Was the same with admin rights.
Then I put the map in my server package, started a temporary server (so boring to have to do that btw) and I voted it. But, (even with admin rights) I got a new error (spawns missing).
So I edited it again, put spawns (1 FFA, 1 RVSF, 1 CLA), saved it, updated it on my server (I had to copy paste CGZ file from my maps directory to my server maps dir). I tried again and I got the same error.
I checked everything : the server had the good map. Spawns were here.
I dunno what to do, really.

So my questions are :
1) Why the server does like if there was no spawn ?
2) Why it's so boring now to share a map ? I lost 30 min to show it and I didn't solve the real problem, I changed perm of the server to be able to vote it. But I shouldn't need because they ARE spawns.

Thanks.

[#M|A#Wolf]

It also now seems if you only have the .cgz of a map it can't load.

[MathiasB]

I had the same problem, but i after i putted spawns it was OK... (however i still have to put it in server maps)

When i try to send it says: 'Map is read only'

[Luc@s]

It also now seems if you only have the .cgz of a map it can't load.

What do you mean ?

Well, I joined a CFG file to the map, I added an incoming directory, had to change perms (windows sucks... by default sub directories are not writable in program files etc.)
It's now working. Thanks for your answers.
But I'm still wondering why I had this bug :/

[#M|A#Wolf]

When you get the custom maps from server maprots now, it saves on to your maps folder twice with two types of files; .cfg and .cgz. I guess .cgz is the map generally and .cfg is the documentation, but when I get a map from a download that a player made or a pack, since it's the more usual thing to only give the .cgz, it looks like it needs the .cfg file for it to work, otherwise it won't let you load it, not even offline.

[JMM]

The cfg gile is the configuration file, it is very much needed.

[R4zor]

..and the fact that .cfg's aren't automatically made as of yet (?) is a problem.

[MathiasB]

But in 1.0.4 wasn't it a problem... it has to do something with the fact that those maps are begun in 1.0.4 and finished in 1.1 and nothing with .cfg

[#M|A#Wolf]

Maybe that's the reason Mathias; but in 1.0.4 you didn't need the .cfg file, now you do :/

[Brahma]

I must admit the new map policy is really complicate...
The sendmap/getmap, basic sane checks, and spawn permissions things were fixed/enhanced by stef... but before I saw that, I was already coding extra sanity checks (like the max area and mean ceil height...). And not only this... to avoid people of playing in coop official maps, the coop permissions got a bit messed (now it is fixed, i believe it).

The point is: everything looks to be too much more complicate now.

The server sendmap permissions are inside -M. You use -Mcru to allow "creating", "revert" and "update" maps the server have in its incoming folder. The defaults were -MCRU, but in the next update will be -McRU (I am not sure if it is right yet, tbh), but the I expect to people be able to send new maps in any server (except if the server owner does not allow it explicitly).

And you NEED to send the map before vote it.
The server NEEDS to check the map before load it in multiplayer.
In 1.0, it was a mess, because you were able to vote a map the server does not have, and if you did not send it, all players would play in the wrong map (depending of the 1.0.x).

Once you sent the map, if the map is not "good", you will not be able to make the server load it even if you are ADMIN.

If you want to show a new map, send it to the server and vote it in coop. Coop does not check for area, ceil or items, so you will be able to share it with other players.

To allow coop for not-admins, you need to use -Pe server switch.

[MathiasB]

I've even probs with sending the map:


(i did -Mcur)

---

After i posted my previous post i deleted the map from my 'Server maps' folder, try it again and have following message:

[Luc@s]

@ Brahma thanks for explanation

@ MathiasB I guess you're using Apple
Did you make an incoming directory ?
Does your server has writable rights in it ?

[Brahma]

Mathias... Luc@s is right.

Also, you cannot overwrite a "read-only" map, no matter the server switches or admin role.
Only the server owner, with real access to the machine where the server runs, can do that. (But you realized this by yourself...)

[V-Man]

..and the fact that .cfg's aren't automatically made as of yet (?) is a problem.

Another great reason to code in extra arguments for the "writecfg" command.

[request] Command to write or add to config files in-game

[SELECT ALL] Code:

/makecfg "test.cfg" [alias starttime (millis); sleep ($test) [echo "test complete!"; echo (- (millis) $starttime)]]
/addcfg "test.cfg" [echo "version 0.1"]

(From http://forum.cubers.net/thread-16-post-7...ml#pid7203 )

[MathiasB]

Also, you cannot overwrite a "read-only" map, no matter the server switches or admin role.

What is a "read-only" map?
Is that something new in 1.1 ?

[MathiasB]

I tried on many ways, but i can't upload my map to any server, even not with admin pass...
It's only possible to vote/show my when it's placed manually at the server.

Anyone else having this prob?

[Ronald_Reagan]

Yes, when trying to test your map :P

[V-Man]

I think it'd be useful to notify the person attempting to upload a map (if it's being rejected) exactly what parameters it is being rejected for, and what parameters it should be to be acceptable.

[Brahma]

This is true... but it also give a tool to many people produce weird maps in the limits of the requirements...
Anyway, the issue from Mathias is about sendmap permissions, which is fixed in 1.1.0.2..

[MathiasB]

Ok, i'm waiting for 1.1.0.2 :D

[JMM]

This is true... but it also give a tool to many people produce weird maps in the limits of the requirements...
Anyway, the issue from Mathias is about sendmap permissions, which is fixed in 1.1.0.2..

TBH it's not very clever not to tell the map maker why the map is being rejected. I do see your point, but mappers are forced too guess why the map is being rejected, which again means they'll have to spend countless hours on modifications, layout changes and so forth just to fix a nonexistent problem and guessing why it might be rejected.

If I had to do a major overhaul for my map just to find that the map is still rejected, I'd be mighty mad, especially if I had no idea whether it's still the same albeit changed are causing it, or if there's other areas that do not fit within the limits.

There is simply no way to make a computer program tell whether a map is good or bad. Too many limits will just ruin the mapping experience. For every good map that's being rejected and causing its maker endless grief there's going to be at least two shit maps that do make it through, even if you choose to not give legit mappers valuabe feedback that they need.

[Brahma]

You are right, JMM... and I did not put extra info because I am overworked these days...

Anyway, the server logs already explain the reasons:

When the reason are the items, it is printed the item and the position (x,y) coordinates.
In edit mode you can use the command, /go_to x y to find the exact position of the item.

[SELECT ALL] Code:

Items too close health 1.00 (111,4)
[x] client Brahma failed to call a vote: load map 'storage_shed' in mode 'deathmatch' (invalid vote)

Items too close grenades 0.01 (148,91)
[x] client Brahma failed to call a vote: load map 'crap_labyrinth' in mode 'deathmatch' (invalid vote)

Items too close akimbo pistol (107,206)
[x] client Brahma failed to call a vote: load map 'Public-town' in mode 'deathmatch' (invalid vote)

Items too close grenades 0.08 (41,58)
[x] client Brahma failed to call a vote: load map 'tennis_sliders_hideaway' in mode 'deathmatch' (invalid vote)

When the reason is the area or the ceil height, just check respectively the MA and the H in such entries:

[SELECT ALL] Code:

Map height density information for ac_victorian: H = 15.91 V = 2924469, A = 183768 and MA = 0
Map height density information for ac_shortway: H = 17.02 V = 380846, A = 22373 and MA = 0
Map height density information for ac_derb: H = 22.47 V = 1146626, A = 51028 and MA = 0
Map height density information for ac_sand2: H = 11.10 V = 476672, A = 42942 and MA = 0
Map height density information for destiny: H = 16.75 V = 244562, A = 14601 and MA = 0
Map height density information for ac_brick: H = 13.69 V = 188137, A = 13739 and MA = 0
Map height density information for ac_desertica: H = 13.62 V = 137693, A = 10109 and MA = 1597
Map height density information for ac_riverdry: H = 16.18 V = 219885, A = 13588 and MA = 1597
Map height density information for apollo_castle: H = 25.36 V = 1336900, A = 52718 and MA = 1597
Map height density information for ac_fold: H = 20.41 V = 1027298, A = 50321 and MA = 1597
Map height density information for ac_2fast2furious: H = 13.97 V = 641557, A = 45936 and MA = 1597
Map height density information for ac_sand: H = 15.92 V = 956274, A = 60067 and MA = 1597
Map height density information for ac_stockade: H = 11.58 V = 470997, A = 40672 and MA = 1597
Map height density information for ac_desert: H = 11.23 V = 266445, A = 23719 and MA = 2005
Map height density information for ac_desert: H = 11.23 V = 266445, A = 23719 and MA = 2005
Map height density information for ac_desert: H = 11.23 V = 266445, A = 23719 and MA = 2005
Map height density information for ac_arena: H = 11.88 V = 557381, A = 46928 and MA = 2005
Map height density information for ac_desert: H = 11.23 V = 266445, A = 23719 and MA = 2005
Map height density information for ac_elgin: H = 19.90 V = 680576, A = 34199 and MA = 2352
Map height density information for ac_arctic: H = 13.49 V = 522123, A = 38700 and MA = 1221
Map height density information for ac_depot: H = 10.00 V = 1550415, A = 154990 and MA = 1221
Map height density information for ac_africa: H = 10.84 V = 432467, A = 39913 and MA = 1221
Map height density information for ac_werk: H = 11.13 V = 414050, A = 37188 and MA = 1597
Map height density information for ac_edifice: H = 13.76 V = 743679, A = 54064 and MA = 1597

If H > 30 or MA > 10000, the map will be refused.

Now think seriously... this community broke in the past due to crap maps struggles... I believe it is far better to force the good map makers to take some care in their creations, than to give an easy tool to the noobs create their twin towers.

[JMM]

Now think seriously... this community broke in the past due to crap maps struggles... I believe it is far better to force the good map makers to take some care in their creations, than to give an easy tool to the noobs create their twin towers.

I know, but - even though I know I'm going a bit off topic - I'd really like to see measures other than this implemented. For example, if a map is voted in that does NOT fit within the limits, you could simply have all votes for maps that don't fit these limits either blocked for, dunno, maybe an hour? Also, I sugggested this before, I'd like the idea of a server owner being able to set up his own whitelist, so there would be a similar limit as to how often non-whitelisted maps are allowed to be voted in.

I know the reasons behind these limits, but I think just having absolute, artificial limits apply to every scenario is no good (I've already explained my stance on this). And I think that these limits should only apply to maps not on the maprot; I do think there shouldn't be any checking like this done on maps on the maprots, and what you can or can't put on the rotation should follow those well-known common sense rules we had in place, you know, long before 1.1 came out (no too much lag, no gemas, no sniper towers, wqd within limits, no fullbright, yadadada).

As for breaking community... well, to be fair I think these shit maps were a significant problem only before any masterserver moderation was in place (you know, back when 24/7 dust2 was the norm and servers pushed gemas and all the other crap). I know they stuck around even after that, but I wouldn't say it was community-breaking. It could have contributed, yes, but I'm not going to start another essay on AC community.

[jamz]

If H > 30 or MA > 10000, the map will be refused.

This can't be right. The MA value is map independent, from what I can see.

[SELECT ALL] Code:

Aug 15 22:48:35: Map height density information for ac_desert: H = 11.23 V = 266445, A = 23719 and MA = 1597
Aug 15 22:48:58: Map height density information for ac_desert: H = 11.23 V = 266445, A = 23719 and MA = 2005

[Brahma]

@jamz
Yes.... i already fixed this... (I realized from my own post too)...
The MA was changing only when someone tried to vote a map, but *not* when the map was being chose by the map rotation... So, it was possible in 1.1.0.1 to put WorldWarII_DDay in your maprot, and the server successfully load it.

@JMM
Yes... I understand your point. But it is not possible to create exceptions without open space to possible exploits. It is the same as servers with more than 20 players. Some servers have enough bandwidth to support more than 30 players, but the majority of the servers don't. Anyway, AC was not designed to a 15x15 ac_complex. The same is valid to the crap maps... I love to play a stupid headshot city or a dodgeball, but this taste is a great disrespect to makke (and all other mappers from this community) which spent days of life creating amazing artworks with high gameplay. Make headshot city (or any other crap-not-fitted-to-the-engine) allowed to be voted in multiplayer, even if for one game only, perverts the original idea and all effort these mappers and coders put in this game.

[JMM]

But, like I've said, I'm more concerned about genuinely good maps that are no longer allowed. And to be fair (and this is only my opinion, if I'm wrong devs are free to correct me), I don't think it's disrespectful, unless you go out of your way to push crap maps everywhere that don't fit the theme of the game (setting upservers that have crap maps on 24/7, spam-voting them in anywhere and everywhere, only and ONLY using the game as a sandbox for funny-for-a-moment experiments and so on).

LATE EDIT: Just to clear it out, after all this off-topic'ing, I'd really like to stress the point that mappers do need to be told what's wrong with the maps, you can safely ignore everything else I said.